how the blues... torrent

evan:) · Post by **evan:)** » Wed Jan 24, 2007 10:08 am

Not my upload just something i found :

http://www.purelivegigs.com/forums/show ... _4871.html

Old Git · Post by **Old Git** » Wed Jan 24, 2007 5:08 pm

This looks hugely interesting but incredibly slow! Are there any sources that it can be obtained from. The Velvets link that I posted was really fast, simple and (I think) I knew what I was doing! Similarly so the b.o.g.o.f link. Any other bright ideas?

Cheers for the tip though - let's hope it works out well!

minimoog · Post by **minimoog** » Thu Jan 25, 2007 9:30 am

Its here aswell:

http://www.demonoid.com/files/details/807171/1624406/

Old Git · Post by **Old Git** » Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:20 am

Thanks for the tip! Got my next door neighbors son to download it - bloody firewall at work!

Now, where's the artwork.....!

cappin · Post by **cappin** » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:58 am

any tips on which "torrent" to download or if not that could anyone "megaupload" it?

thanks

x

Old Git · Post by **Old Git** » Fri Jan 26, 2007 10:00 am

Okay, one next door neighbour and conversion to wav. file later, the news is in. This is awesome! Even the hypnobeat track has got better with age - Sonic ahead of his time? But the absolute killer track has got to be Rollercoaster.

Okay, it's not perfect and the early singing is a bit wobbly but on sonic assault level theis is simply magnificent! This is how I remember them sat on cheap plastic chairs in Morecambe, Manchester, Sheffield etc. Simple almost primeval stuff.

Even the dodgy acoustic balance of it seems like early gigs when the sound bounced off the walls.

Don't know if Sonic 'visits' here too often - he's probably aware of other routes to this astral pot of gold now exist but I tried to buy it legit but wasn't able.

Couple of last questions:

1. Does anyone know of any 'crits' on this - origins, dates etc - like to know them. Was there any info on the back of the original sleeves?

2. Will there be another slice? I mean, I read all the crap on Sonic sending out stuff and the angst that generated but how about downloads from othe other tracks that hit the original CDr floor? I know I'd be keen - anyone else.

Listen and enjoy!!!

cappin · Post by **cappin** » Fri Jan 26, 2007 5:43 pm

woop woop! got it! i also got NEU! 4...

another woop woop would work well

thank you wherever you are

x

KevW · Post by **KevW** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:29 pm

I can't get any of that load to work. Can anyone help?

Cheers.

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 3:16 pm

No seeders! Bah!

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 3:20 pm

Got it!!! Stealing music never felt so good.

KevW · Post by **KevW** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:18 pm

flamingrev wrote:Got it!!! Stealing music never felt so good.

Lucky. I still can't get it to work! Just stole the new BRMC album though.

They Transmit · Post by **They Transmit** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:04 pm

Thieving pricks, don't come complaing when there are no decent new bands coming through, maybe I'll come round and kick your door in and take something you spent months working on, cos hey it's free right...

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:47 pm

HAHAHAHA

There's lots of good bands still coming through, what are you talking about?

And this isn't in print, so even if I did want to buy it, I couldn't.

And when it was for sale, it cost an arm and a leg.

Personally, I've never downloaded an album that I could go to the store and buy. Although I often buy used CD's, and in that case no money goes to the artist anyway, which it really wouldn't even if I bought it new.

They Transmit · Post by **They Transmit** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:00 pm

"There's lots of good bands still coming through, what are you talking about?"

Yes there may well be, but seeing as how there is very little return on investment in most bands cases, bands get dropped instantly by most labels these days where as in the past you could carry on without being a "seller"

"And this isn't in print, so even if I did want to buy it, I couldn't."

And now it never will be back in print.

"... no money goes to the artist anyway, which it really wouldn't even if I bought it new."

You my friend are a fool.

mojo filters · Post by **mojo filters** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:39 pm

flamingrev wrote:Although I often buy used CD's, and in that case no money goes to the artist anyway, which it really wouldn't even if I bought it new.

Err...no - you clearly have no understanding of how licensing/publishing rights money works if you think artists don't benefit when buying new records

Buying used CDs is a different kettle of the oft-used proverbial fish, because the royalties have already been paid.

I hate rock 'n' roll
And all these people with nothing to show

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 6:30 pm

They Transmit wrote:Thieving pricks, don't come complaing when there are no decent new bands coming through, maybe I'll come round and kick your door in and take something you spent months working on, cos hey it's free right...

mojo filters wrote:Err...no - you clearly have no understanding of how licensing/publishing rights money works if you think artists don't benefit when buying new records

Buying used CDs is a different kettle of the oft-used proverbial fish, because the royalties have already been paid.

I hate rock 'n' roll
And all these people with nothing to show

"Slam DUNK!!! Take THAT, flamingrev!!!"

They Transmit · Post by **They Transmit** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 6:43 pm

Post rock Batman and Robin, righting the wrongs of evil music bandits everywhere...

cappin · Post by **cappin** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:30 pm

It's all a bit silly if you ask me. Music should be free (I'm not talking about currency here, people). If music gets to the listener, does something positive, influences the listener, inspires the listener and makes them feel some kind of fucking feeling in this life... Whatâ€™s the problem? I'd be over the moon knowing many a person would be enjoying my music

(Oh yeah, check out my myspace at http://www.myspace.com/...........).

x

...clichetoupee

hahahaha

They Transmit · Post by **They Transmit** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:28 pm

Ah Utopia. No bills, no paying rent, no paying for rehearsal space or equipment, no praticing for months on end, no eating next to nothing. Give it all away for free, those musicians are so damn selfish aren't they, how dare they want some come back for years of doing it all out of their own pockets.
I mean really, all music is written and recorded in a day...for free... so you can take it from some file share without guilt, cos hey this isn't stealing is it?

Post by **runcible** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:54 pm

flamingrev wrote:
And when it was for sale, it cost an arm and a leg.

Personally, I've never downloaded an album that I could go to the store and buy.

It was indeed pricey. But you contradict yourself here. You say it was too expensive, but then you would never download it if you could actually buy it. You had a chance to buy it when it first appeared but didn't even though you could have done quite easily. So now you are downloading it. Because it was too expensive. So you waited until you can effectively pinch it by downloading it. Even though you had an opportunity to buy it. Except it was too expensive. Etc. etc.

Seems to me you're talking crap mate.

a beautiful noise · Post by **a beautiful noise** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 10:44 pm

I hate rock 'n' roll
And all these people with nothing to show

i hate MTV, i hate it when they're pissing on me

mojo filters · Post by **mojo filters** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 10:53 pm

a beautiful noise wrote:I hate rock 'n' roll
And all these people with nothing to show

i hate MTV, i hate it when they're pissing on me

But I gave you all I had, I good and bad, I gave but you just threw it back

Oh I'm the lucky son, son of a gun...I went away and now I'm back

Yeah baby come on!

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 4:27 am

If a CD is in print and I can purchase it for a reasonable sum, I will do so. When a group that I like has a new album out, I try to get it as soon as it hits the stores.

Often at shows I buy t-shirts that I turn around and give to a friend. I don't wear band shirts that often but I know that groups make their $$$ from merch.

If the music I want is out of print or costs $40 per CDR, I will download it.

If there is a contradiction there, I can live with it quite happily. Actually, in looking back over what I said, there is no contradiction. I can not, and could not, go to the store and buy this. I was not able to look at it, and at a store it would not be a CD-R. If this ever does show up in a store, and I'm betting it will when Sonic needs some more scratch, I'll buy it for $20 a disc.

Sonic was selling a finite amount of these, and they're gone. So how is downloading this taking $$$ from him?

I understand that downloading music rampantly and with disregard for the artists can hurt the musicians that I care so much about. But to say that occurs in every case of downloading is ridiculous. I just downloaded Neil Young's "Time Fades Away," which has been out of print for years. If he ever reissues it, I'll buy it. What about The Real Complete Works set? Should I feel guilty for having a copy of that?

They Transmit · Post by **They Transmit** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 9:03 am

"If the music I want is out of print or costs $40 per CDR, I will download it. "

Can't you see how stupid this is?

If music is out of print, then is rampantly downloaded, do you really think your actions will be a positive step in getting it re-issued?

But hey stealing just a little bit is ok isn't it, it's not as if it will really make a big difference further down the line...

helterskelter · Post by **helterskelter** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 9:37 am

I'm a firm supporter of Sp3/Spectrum and always try and turn friends onto the music but I didn't pay Â£40 cause i couldn't afford it at the time and did think it was too expensive - I do now have a burnt copy and although there are jems on it I'm still glad I didn't spend Â£40 on it. Just don't think it was worth it.

I'm comfortable with this to be honest - can't wait for the spectrum lp and will buy it direct from source if i can. It's easy to be holier than thou sometimes especially here, particularly here for some reason!

If you can say that 99% of your record collection has been bought and paid for then I for one can sleep sound at night.

They Transmit · Post by **They Transmit** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 10:17 am

I remember in the 80's a huge push by record companies saying "home taping is killing music", I thought it was a right load at the time, but they were right, just 20 years too early.
You can't justify downloading music, at the end of the day it is wrong and is actively fucking this industry. And it is an industry, for bands to exist record companys have to get a return.
Do you think Mr.Pierce is touring with an acoustic band because its an artistic statement or in actual fact he is skint and can't afford to tour with a full electric band band?
The Acoustic Mainline shows recorded by Tim Holmes were done for free cos our beloved Mr.Pierce is on his uppers.

Throw away society with throw away attitudes.
Have you tried getting a record out recently...Oh the times they are a changin'
The fact still remains, keep downloading and there will be no more Spiritualized et al cos the big record companies will only pump cash into what has the highest returns .i.e chart shit.

This is a fact of which I will remind everyone of in the next 5 years when all your beloved niche underground bands have jacked it in as they can't survive or even get a record out...
Yes a lot of people will buy a t-shirt at a show, or the official release, but this is not the norm at all and most downloaders will never put their hands in their pockets and shell out to support the bands they claim to love so deeply.
I work in the industry, this is the current state of play, it is not fantasy. Downloading is not helping anyone but yourself.
If a record is too expensive, do you steal it from the record store?

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:44 pm

we are all dicks.

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:22 pm

If music is out of print, then is rampantly downloaded, do you really think your actions will be a positive step in getting it re-issued?

That's right. The most bootlegged albums in history, Prince's Black Album, Dylan's Royal Albert Hall, will never get a proper release because everyone already has them. If an out of print album gets downloaded massively, don't you think it's more likely that the labels would see that as a sign of demand and put it out? As it is, I don't think enough people are downloading or care about "How The Blues..." to make a difference. If Sonic wants this in stores, it will be in stores because the band has a built in fan-base that will buy just about anything, although in limited numbers. Just like The Stooges.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:06 pm

flamingrev wrote:If an out of print album gets downloaded massively, don't you think it's more likely that the labels would see that as a sign of demand and put it out?

Yeah-yeah. I can think of loads of examples in the last few years. Most recent, right off top of my head, John Phillips' "Wolfking".

Post by **runcible** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:21 pm

flamingrev wrote:
Sonic was selling a finite amount of these, and they're gone. So how is downloading this taking $$$ from him?

Because you had a chance to buy this set when it first appeared. They weren't gone then, you just didn't buy one.

I can't agree with your point of view one iota.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:38 pm

runcible wrote:Because you had a chance to buy this set when it first appeared. They weren't gone then, you just didn't buy one.

There could be any number of reasons why someone didn't buy it at the time, like not being all over this site and Sonic's at the time it was being sold for instance. Others just didn't wanna pay Â£40 for a double CDR. Moot point now tho, cos Sonic sold his 100 copies and got every penny he expected to get in exchange for them.

I agree with flamingrev's point of view every iota, because I sense he - like most of us - is a guy who has been blowing his disposable income on music since his teens. Not my idea of a 'thieving prick'. HTBSTO is effectively an out-of-print item. If Sonic was to put that stuff out on Space Age, I betcha flamingrev and the majority of others who downloaded it would buy. Betcha. So Sonic loses nothing. I don't see an iota of logic in the suggestion that he does.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:57 pm

They Transmit wrote:If music is out of print, then is rampantly downloaded, do you really think your actions will be a positive step in getting it re-issued?

To restate: yes. Can think of literally dozens of examples from the last few years. And plenty of people for whom those albums were a holy grail, who were all kinds of thrilled when they managed to finally hear whatever it was, and who were first in line when it was granted a sudden reissue months later.

"Wolfking" is a good example, cos I remember people on this forum (and other forums) hunting that album...what?...a year ago? And lo, after years in the OOP wilderness, it was back in print within 12 months. Ace.

I'll say this again too, I'd LOVE more people to talk about "Robin's Reign" on boards like this. It's a junk-y lil' minor fave of mine. It's never been on CD tho, but I'll happily share a needledrop with anyone who wants to hear. Maybe some of you guys will like it, spread the word, start a buzz, get a demand going, and we'll see a reissue.

You gonna tell me that, say, Dennis Wilson's POB can't get a reissue just cos people've already downloaded it? Nah. It's because the parties involved can't agree over who owns the music. People want to hear that album. They *should* hear that album. And when it finally does get a re-release, the majority of the downloaders will be first in line to buy.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:14 pm

That version of "Transparent Radiation" should've been on "Forged Presriptions" btw. It's awesome, a missing link between the TDTTMTTDT and TPP versions, with the heavy organ ululation and the violin both present. Love it.

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:22 pm

There's an album i'm after by Global Communication, Pentamerous Metamorphosis is what it's called, been OOP for quite a while as far as i know. I'm not totally desperate to get hold of a copy, but getting a copy would be great. Seen a few copies on FleaBay but they are way too pricey for me at the moment and can't see that option changing very much anytime soon.

So what do i do ?? Obvious answer is to download it as i want to hear it so much, isn't it ? Well fuck that i say, i'll wait until it might get another run or i see it at a reasonable price, reasonable to me anyway. And in the meantime i'll just contine listening to stuff i've never, ever heard before and enjoy doing so. And by that i mean i'll do so by buying stuff that as not gone out of print, old and new.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:52 pm

The Jig wrote:Well fuck that i say, i'll wait until it might get another run or i see it at a reasonable price

I get ya totally. It's nice to actually own these things, in nicely packaged non-compressed form.
I don't do much downloading, got enough problems cataloging all the crap I ripped to the PC myself with a view to creating homemade anthologies of fave bands and such. But I do think it's good that people are sharing the rare stuff around in moderation. And if someone sends me something that they think I should hear, I'll listen.

Point is, I don't think we have a load of 'music thieves' here. Even the guy back over the page who said he'd nicked the new BRMC seemed like he was just being flippant. He'll probably buy the thing when it comes out.

Yeah, people building whole libraries of music without paying a dime is fucked-up. Those folk exist. But the guilty ain't among us.

Post by **runcible** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 9:10 pm

Spamuel L. Jackson wrote: There could be any number of reasons why someone didn't buy it at the time, like not being all over this site and Sonic's at the time it was being sold for instance. Others just didn't wanna pay Â£40 for a double CDR. Moot point now tho, cos Sonic sold his 100 copies and got every penny he expected to get in exchange for them.

But flamingrev WAS all over this site at that time. So that's that argument out of the way. Sure, he didn't want to pay that price. Fine. But you can bet the guy thought he'd wait until it was actually available as a download, as did many. The download generation think this way.

I'd remind you that his initial post that sparked these retorts said 'Stealing music never felt so good.' I think that sums it up.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 9:24 pm

runcible wrote:I'd remind you that his initial post that sparked these retorts said 'Stealing music never felt so good.' I think that sums it up.

And I'll bet he was just being flip.
But whether flamingrev wanted to shell out or not at the time is academic.
When Boom does a 100-only run on these, he can't honestly expect people not to want to hear the stuff down the line. I know of one BIG Spacemen fan who didn't even know HTBSTO existed. I hooked him up.
Boom's in-print albums being bulk-downloaded by people who don't then go and buy them would be another matter.

I still don't see how Sonic is being harmed. Show me how. I don't see the logic.

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 9:52 pm

I knew about the set as soon as it was announced. I got excited. I saw the price tag and realized how much was being charged for CD-R's, and how I could not afford to pay that much for the product. At the same time, I bought a copy of a The Spectrum Chronicles CD in a music store. This CD was originally a "limited" CD-R release that eventually wound up in stores, and the quality of the release was pretty shoddy.

I thought "well, this is the same thing he's doing with the Spacemen set. "Limited" CD-R's that he's charging a lot for, and the material is scraping the bottom of the barrel, and eventually it will be released in a more affodable format in the stores. I will wait for that to occur, and soon enough I'll be able to download it for free anyways." And it has come to pass. If it comes out in the stores, I'll buy it. Because I like things that say "Spacemen 3" on it.

Personally, I think that Sonic sometimes comes across as an arrogant twat on this message board. I know some of you have worked with him and you like and respect him, and I understand that I've had a most limited view of him as a person. But because of this, and because of the high price that was being charged for burnt CD's, I said in a flippant manner, "stealing music never felt so good." It was stated this way because of some people's reaction to the notion of downloading music. But it did feel good.

If Sonic cared so much about due compensation/acknowledgement, why isn't Jason getting a cut of HTBSHTO's proceeds? Why aren't the artists/labels on the Spacelines comp getting paid? Isn't he STEALING music that's on those CD's and profiting from other people's work?

catweazel · Post by **catweazel** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 10:16 am

I dont wanna get into a war of words.

was a bit harsh...my apologies

KevW · Post by **KevW** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:08 pm

So anyway....

Anyone wanna up load it or send me a copy!

I have stuff to trade should that be necessary!

PM me on the sly....

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 1:19 pm

I dont wanna get into a war of words.

was a bit harsh...my apologies

Last edited by Spamuel L. Jackson on Wed Mar 21, 2007 1:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:05 pm

Ugh. I just had a thought. Threads that feature pages of bitching over a few people downloading an effectively out-of-print item, but negligible amounts of discussion of the music on the damn discs? Bah.

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:39 pm

Spamuel L. Jackson wrote:I get ya totally. It's nice to actually own these things, in nicely packaged non-compressed form.
I don't do much downloading, got enough problems cataloging all the crap I ripped to the PC myself with a view to creating homemade anthologies of fave bands and such. But I do think it's good that people are sharing the rare stuff around in moderation. And if someone sends me something that they think I should hear, I'll listen.

Yeah, people building whole libraries of music without paying a dime is fucked-up. Those folk exist. But the guilty ain't among us.

The only things i download are the 'yousendit' links put on here, not all of them, but probably about 60/65% of them. Out of that percentage i guess more or less all of them are new to me which is why i download them. I've followed up on loads of links and gone out and paid for an album or two. That's the only music i download from the internet. Well very occasionally if i come across a site that have MP3's of something that interests me i'd maybe download a couple.

I don't know how to torrent, don't use file sharing sites, don't understand FLAC'S and other formats, don't download full albums, don't like compressed music all that much, don't think it's right, don't have anything against any individual who cares to do that, again don't think it's right though, don't think there's anything cooler than building a library of bang-on music in a non digital way and don't you think it would be easier to say i have ''blahblahblah'' for download, PM me for the links.

Having said that, 'SongOfTheDay' is one of the better threads on this board, and look what happened to the very nice guy who started it, oh what a shame.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 5:05 pm

TheJig wrote:I don't know how to torrent

TheJig wrote:don't use file sharing sites

TheJig wrote:don't think there's anything cooler than building a library of bang-on music in a non digital way

Me neither. X 3

TheJig wrote:and don't you think it would be easier to say i have ''blahblahblah'' for download, PM me for the links.

In what instances? U_nderscore himself posted the Dennis Wilson album up on the board in compressed form (iirc). He posted it for anyone who wanted to hear an album that is shamefully out-of-print.

I don't really follow. You kind of implied you didn't have any beef with the exchange of OOP material, but that you don't do it yourself. Cool.
I just don't there's any great sin in sharing that stuff around. At all. And yes, I do think it helps generate the kind of buzz that can prompt a reissue. That's proven.
Crazies who start up blogs offering multiple boxsets of in-print officially available material is a whole other issue.

TheJig wrote:Having said that, 'SongOfTheDay' is one of the better threads on this board, and look what happened to the very nice guy who started it, oh what a shame.

What happened to him that was so bad? He quit the board out of choice. I spoke to him. He thanked me for my positive words to him, and explained that he didn't have time to wade thru a swamp of extraneous o/t postage in order to get to the creek-water (music recommendations etc.). I respect that I guess, but can't really see the culture he was referring to.

"You can come back to us any time you want to."
-Dylan [/paraphrase]

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 5:21 pm

I wrote:I just don't there's any great sin in sharing that stuff around. At all.

What about, say, decent copies of Beatles albums? The official UK CD releases are shite. If someone bought those, they shouldn't feel any guilt about also downloading a few vinyl rips of the albums as they should be heard. IMO.
Sure, it's better if you can find the actual Ebbetts boots in hard copy, or even better a well kept first LP pressing, but there's nothing wrong with fans trading digital copies for the purpose of research and study. That knowledge can actually *help* a person build a cooly discriminating hardass record-collection. A good one of those should always place quality over quantity anyway.

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 6:02 pm

Spamuel L. Jackson wrote:I don't really follow. You kind of implied you didn't have any beef with the exchange of OOP material, but that you don't do it yourself. Cool.
I just don't there's any great sin in sharing that stuff around.

That's right. I don't really care that much if people want or need to download OOP material. I don't really care if people don't want to do that either. I don't do it myself, but that my choice. There's nothing wrong in occasionlly putting up a song of an artist and downloading an occasional link, if it helps a band out by someone who goes out and buys stuff then great.

Everyone should, by now, have some sort of idea and knowledge of how to obtain those downloads, simply go on to a downloading file sharing site. Post up a message on an online forum if needed saying PM for a link to a certain album (hopefully OOP). I can't see point in claiming it's never felt so good to steal though.

Spamuel L. Jackson wrote:he didn't have time to wade thru a swamp of extraneous o/t postage in order to get to the creek-water (music recommendations etc.). I respect that I guess, but can't really see the culture he was referring to.

I thought it was pretty easy to see what he was referring to, but this thread isn't about u_derscore so apologies for mentioning him.

Spamuel L. Jackson · Post by **Spamuel L. Jackson** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 6:24 pm

The Jig wrote:Post up a message on an online forum if needed saying PM for a link to a certain album (hopefully OOP).

Eh? You seem to have a bugbear about that. Dunno what to say. I guess folk don't do that because they think that if whatever it is will interest people, it's just easier to post the link than send out multiple PM's? Or because then maybe (and it's only a maybe) an on-board discussion about the music might ensue? Y'know, the kind of talk we could've had on this very thread if we weren't all busy bitching about a few downloads of some material that you can't even go out and buy.

TheJig wrote:I can't see point in claiming it's never felt so good to steal though.

Do you think it could maybe have been a reaction to the guerilla-defensiveness routinely employed by the 'thieving prick' brigade? Just a knee-jerk thing, rather than a statement of pernicious intent?

And if we follow that logic, then what's the point of *anything* anyone says here? All we're doing is exchanging thoughts and words. Transient shit.

TheJig wrote:I thought it was pretty easy to see what he was referring to

K. I don't see it. You do. Then why not just ride it out 'til things swing back in your favor? Why up and split over that?

Post by **runcible** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:44 pm

flamingrev wrote:
If Sonic cared so much about due compensation/acknowledgement, why isn't Jason getting a cut of HTBSHTO's proceeds?

...which leads on to whether Pete gets a cut of releases featuring songs he co-wrote like Walkin' With Jesus or Take Me To The Other Side or Things'll Never Be The Same. All these appeared on Spiritualized releases without acknowledgment and probably without royalties too. I don't think Pete's too bothered to be honest.

But we weren't discussing that as you know.

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 12:41 am

Blah blah blah, yackity schmackity.

Post by **runcible** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:52 am

flamingrev wrote:Blah blah blah, yackity schmackity.

Wow - surely the best point you've made so far...

mh · Post by mh » Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:14 pm

I think "without acknowledgement" is definitely a bit much. I definitely remember seeing "Kember/Pierce" credits on Albert Hall and Let It Flow (and also different publishing being listed), and have no recollection of where TMTTOS appeared on a Spz record.

mojo filters · Post by **mojo filters** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:34 pm

mh wrote:I think "without acknowledgement" is definitely a bit much. I definitely remember seeing "Kember/Pierce" credits on Albert Hall and Let It Flow (and also different publishing being listed), and have no recollection of where TMTTOS appeared on a Spz record.

In respect of the credits you mentioned on rah I believe you are correct. I think the point being made is PK hasn't made a big deal and has openly acknowledged the complications of co-writing credits in writing/interview/person, as opposed to JP's gross generalisation in stating he's never seen any money from post-SM3 break-up releases that he's entitled to...draw whatever inference you will

Post by **runcible** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:43 pm

mh wrote:I think "without acknowledgement" is definitely a bit much. I definitely remember seeing "Kember/Pierce" credits on Albert Hall and Let It Flow (and also different publishing being listed), and have no recollection of where TMTTOS appeared on a Spz record.

Yup - on RAH the credit is there. Can't recall seeing it on the Let It Flow series. TMTTOS was just performed live.

Mojo hits the point I'm making very well indeed. Pete doesn't really care that much. In fact I believe that Gerald Palmer actually copyrighted the name 'Spaceman Records' way before the Tones For DJs 12" came out which would have given him full rights to much of that record's return. He also has full rights to all the Spacemen songs including How The Blues. So that brings him into the happy equation too.

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 12:34 am

What about the artists on the Spacelines comp?

veiko · Post by **veiko** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 9:46 am

i was just thinking that Elvis Presley Foundation (correct me if i'm wrong) did not want Jase to use "Love me tender" in Ladies and Gentlemen.
so, are things changed now and Jase can release the Acoustic Mainline concert album with the medley of Anything More/LAGWAFIS what ended with "Wise man sayed only fools rush in"?

mojo filters · Post by **mojo filters** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 9:52 am

veiko wrote:i was just thinking when Elvis Presley Foundation (correct me if i'm wrong) did not want Jase to use "Love me tender" in Ladies and Gentlemen.
so, are things changed now and Jase can release the Acoustic Mainline concert album with the medley of Anything More/LAGWAFIS what ended with "Wise man sayed only fools rush in"?

That is a good question, and puts into doubt the good, kind work Tim Holmes has done making a multi-tracked recording that could be released

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 4:47 pm

The Jig wrote:Post up a message on an online forum if needed saying PM for a link to a certain album (hopefully OOP).

Spamuel L. Jackson wrote:Eh? You seem to have a bugbear about that. Dunno what to say.

Noooo, i don't have a bugbear about that. It may sound that i do but seriously, i don't. I'm not concerned one way or another. Just thinking out loud and thinking to myself how little things like that might stop all this silly and pointless diatribe.

Spamuel L. Jackson wrote:All we're doing is exchanging thoughts and words. Transient shit.

Yep, that's all i try to do, just sometimes it takes a few trips around the block to get there, plus drink stops.

Post by **runcible** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 6:39 pm

flamingrev wrote:What about the artists on the Spacelines comp?

Dunno. Not got it. But the original point was about downloading and your using the word stealing in relation to it.

mojo filters · Post by **mojo filters** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 7:03 pm

flamingrev wrote:What about the artists on the Spacelines comp?

I believe PK was meticulous in the licensing of that comp...evidence to the contrary is open to question from informed discussion...so in the words of J&MC come on!

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 11:07 pm

I understand that we were discussing my use of the word "stealing," and the moral/ethical implications of downloading music. But it seems we've exhausted that topic, and it still has not been explained how my downloading HTBSHTO has hurt Sonic Boom financially. He had 100 to sell and they sold quickly. Why not expand the topic to other kinds of musical thievery that Sonic may have participated in?

Regarding Jason using songs that he and Sonic wrote together: isn't that a different matter than recordings that Jason actually played on? Jason is all over HTBSHTO. It is an undeniable fact. He is not getting money from the sales of CD's that he is playing on.

Sonic wrote this concerning the Spacelines CD:

sonic boom wrote:
Why are there no credits on the sleeve of the Spacelines Cd?
cos its a bootleg ,out & out.
regds
pk

I take this to mean that the artists are not being compensated, although it is vague and could be taken different ways.

Fuzzhead · Post by **Fuzzhead** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 11:14 pm

Give it a rest, Flamingrev - this is turning into one almighty bore.

flamingrev · Post by **flamingrev** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 11:54 pm

Agreed.

Sometimes it's hard to give it a rest when people are preaching at you about how you are single-handedly ruining the music industry.

toomilk · Post by **toomilk** » Sat Mar 24, 2007 12:38 am

I used to work for Sony BMG until my entire department got axed...AND IT WAS ALL FLAMINGREV'S FAULT!!!

(I kid...the real reason is because they have some of the shittiest artists in the world--minus Primal Scream--on their label that continually make the worst records that anyone has ever heard.)

cappin · Post by **cappin** » Sat Mar 24, 2007 12:19 pm

... Amen to that. So true.

veiko · Post by **veiko** » Sat Mar 24, 2007 2:38 pm

mojo filters wrote:
veiko wrote:i was just thinking when Elvis Presley Foundation (correct me if i'm wrong) did not want Jase to use "Love me tender" in Ladies and Gentlemen.
so, are things changed now and Jase can release the Acoustic Mainline concert album with the medley of Anything More/LAGWAFIS what ended with "Wise man sayed only fools rush in"?
That is a good question, and puts into doubt the good, kind work Tim Holmes has done making a multi-tracked recording that could be released

it doesn't come so dramatic at all. Jase just has to leave out the Anything More/LAGWAFIS song. it's a sad miss, but better to have it released that way than shelve it.

Dreamweapon · Post by **Dreamweapon** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:22 pm

Took me a while to find the subject in the blog but....

On How The Blues... there's obviously the track Hypnobeat.

Did Sonic ever do any more stuff in the vein of this or particularly Big City? Just a thought...

Spiritualized

how the blues... torrent

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how the Blues....

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Re: how the blues... torrent