Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

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redcloud
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Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

Post by redcloud »

Finally, after years of being bootlegged and tapes quietly circulated by fans...'Black Beauty' is now being officially released.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/music_b ... une-7.html


[Title edited by BZA 29/07/2013 to reflect latter posts focusing on the great Forever Changes...]
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by radioshack »

I'm really in love with Forever Changes. Might be my all-time favourite album. Can anyone suggest what album I should get next or any to avoid in the Love/Arthur Lee canon. I was going to give Four Sail a go.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by nickh »

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Last edited by nickh on Mon May 18, 2015 7:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by shalloboi »

i've always thought that the self-titled debut as being my favourite love record besides 'forever changes.' it's not as good, but it's very solid on its own- the songs are varied in tone but the quality is pretty consistent.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by redcloud »

radioshack wrote: Can anyone suggest what album I should get next or any to avoid in the Love/Arthur Lee canon. I was going to give Four Sail a go.
In terms of a man at the pinnacle of his creative peak, 'Forever Changes' is Arthur Lee's greatest and most fully realized body of work. It is easily one of the greatest albums ever recorded. It is a true piece of art that should be cherished forever.

But, for what it is worth, here is my take on all things Love:

Pre-'Forever Changes':

Love-s/t: A gorgeous album chock full of fabulous Southern Californian sunshiney, garage punk/folk. Excellent song writing and one hell of a debut LP. 'My Flash On You' kicks my ass every single time I hear it.

'Da Capo': Side one of their sophomore LP is jaw-droppingly superb! Punkier than the debut, and at times heavier ('Seven & Seven Is'). Arthur's and Bryan Maclean's songwriting were really beginning to blossom. In fact, Side one is arguably the best side of songs they recorded before 'Forever Changes'. But then you flip the record and there is side 2. That is not to say 'Revelations' is bad. It is a mere sketch of a song that they extended to 18 minutes. It totally pales in comparison to the fully realized songs on side one. If it were only a 3'30 song it would be a great tune but sadly, it plods along and really goes nowhere and we just get...well, bored.

Post Forever Changes:

'Four Sail': A new band for Arthur...much more guitar heavy but this album is actually an under appreciated corker! Song wise it might not be in the same league as Arthur's masterpiece, 'FC' but the songs are still superb throughout and the highlights on the album are indeed, quite special. It is worth it for the killer opening track alone ("August")!

'Out Here' I have fond memories of this double album. My college roommate and I used to listen to it ALL THE TIME and as it is a gatefold we would use the cover to separate out the seeds from our weed. In truth though it is probably one side too long, arguably even one albums length too long. There are some killer songs (I love 'Doggone', the electric version of 'Signed DC', 'I Still Wonder', 'Nice To Be', 'I'm Down' and 'Instra-Mental'). But, there is a bit too much filler to pad out the double LP length time. Nothing is dreadful and, like I said, there are some good songs on it but the ideas, Arthur's direction and his band were disconnecting.

In my humble opinion, 'False Start' and 'Reel to Real' are to be avoided. But, of the two 'False Start' is the better one. The unreleased 'Black Beauty' is by far the best album Arthur recorded after 'Out Here'...and it is possibly his best album since 'Four Sail'. I have friends though that rate it higher than 'Four Sail' and think it is his best thing since 'FC'.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by James T »

Forever Changes is up there with the very very best, but I can't really get into their other stuff. De Capo is ok though as has been said already.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by runcible »

I have loads of respect for Arthur Lee and Love but Forever Changes, like Pet Sounds, is one of the all time classic albums I just cannot get into and man I've tried. I love Alone Again Or but the rest leaves me completely unmoved. I give it another go every few years with the same result. I've bought Pet Sounds twice now thinking 'this time I'll get it' but...

Mind you it took me 20 years to 'get' the Grateful Dead and now I love them, and the same with Van Morrison (another mystery until lately) so maybe there's hope!
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by sunray »

runcible wrote:I have loads of respect for Arthur Lee and Love but Forever Changes, like Pet Sounds, is one of the all time classic albums I just cannot get into and man I've tried. I love Alone Again Or but the rest leaves me completely unmoved.
Pretty much how i feel about Forever Changes too. I just do not see the fuss, bores me senseless. Mind you i haven't given it a listen in a few years so maybe now is the time.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by angelsighs »

I think Forever Changes is pretty good but not worthy of all the superlatives or anything..
I'll tell you what though, I saw the band in 2003 and wasn't expecting much but it was one of the most unexpectedly brilliant and uplifting gigs i've ever seen. I walked out with a big smile on my face. they played most of Forever Changes and some other choice tracks.
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"The Name Of That Band Shoulda Been Hate"

Post by BzaInSpace »

I love(!) Forever Changes and Da Capo, but Da Capo definitely got me first. Maybe just for 'Seven and Seven Is'!
True proto-punk genius.
In fact, it was a best of Love (Love Story? I forget) tape I used to have that got me into them into the first place after hearing about them everywhere as an influence in the late 90s.
Basically had choice tracks from the first three albums - stuff like the superb 'Signed DC' from the first one, I think all of the first side of Da Capo and the awesome 'Your Mind And We Belong Together'/'Laughing Stock' single. I don't think it had that many from Forever Changes right enough, just the 'well-known' songs.

Forever Changes... it took forever for me to really like that album as a whole. I think it's could be all the changes and stuff within the songs, but I seem to remember travelling somewhere listening to it and 'The Red Telephone' suddenly hit me, and from there it just seemed to open up. Amazing. For those who have tried before I think it's worth persevering with - it's just not an immediate sort of album I think.

I once owned a copy of Four Sail and was distinctly unimpressed, I think it had an almost glam/metal sound (Lee's obsession with Hendrix maybe), I never replaced it.

I too saw the Love band Lee toured with around 2003, it was actually an amazing gig in a tiny venue... think they all fell out with Arthur soon after.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by Laz69 »

Saw them on their second tour (no idea of the year tbh) and they were brilliant... was it not Baby Lemonade that were his backing band or something... they had the little blond headed guy playing guitar (Randal i think his name was)... a friend of mine's band (The Primary 5) supported them in the Carling Academy in Glasgow and Randal joined his band on stage and played along with them... was amazing to watch...

Love the Forever Changes and De Capo and Love albums, and probably play them all about the same... FC is their pinacle moment to be sure, but some of the tracks on the other albums are just sublime too (love the song My Flash On You for the crackling mini-bass solo... its just so RIGHT for the song! 8) )

I know Hendrix played on one of their albums i believe too, although can't recall which one off the top of my head...
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by redcloud »

I love 'Forever Changes'. It is Arthur's "Heart of Darkness"...his descent into madness. It is so full of emotion that even now about 26 years after I first heard the album it still has the power to make me stop whatever it is I am doing and makes me listen. There are few songs more haunting than 'The Red Telephone' nor as brilliantly written as "Maybe the People Would Be the Times or Between Clark and Hilldale". Musically the guitar solo in "A House Is Not a Motel" floors me everytime I hear it. And how many songs do you know open with..."Oh the snot has caked against my pants...it has turned into crystal"? Arthur's demons were oozing out and he managed to get in tune with them just long enough to compose an astonishing and beautiful piece of art.
BzaInSpace wrote:it was a best of Love (Love Story? I forget) tape I used to have that got me into them into the first place after hearing about them everywhere as an influence in the late 90s.
Basically had choice tracks from the first three albums - stuff like the superb 'Signed DC' from the first one, I think all of the first side of Da Capo and the awesome 'Your Mind And We Belong Together'/'Laughing Stock' single. I don't think it had that many from Forever Changes right enough, just the 'well-known' songs.
Rhino Records Love Anthology, "Love Story" actually included the entire 'Forever Changes' album.

'Your Mind & We Belong Together' is brilliant! Arthur actually recorded some home movies in 1968 and used 'Your Mind & We Belong Together' as its soundtrack. Bit of trivia, the house in the Love home movies was the same house where they filmed Peter Fonda's acid trip in "The Trip".
Laz69 wrote:I know Hendrix played on one of their albums i believe too, although can't recall which one off the top of my head...
'The Everlasting First'...opening track on the 'False Start' LP.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by nickh »

I got to see them a couple of times too and I agree with angelsighs that these were uplifting shows.

First time they were supported by Sky Saxon & The Seeds (and I consider myself pretty fortunate to have seen them too), second was at Glastonbury. I dragged my friends up to the acoustic stage and maybe 4 songs in I turned to ask them how good they thought Love were, they had all buggered off to the bar. :roll:
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by angelsighs »

I saw that Glastonbury set too- well, sort of. by the time we had traipsed across the site the tent was really full so we had to just sit on the grass outside and listen. I remember him changing the outro of The Red Telephone to "They're locking them up today/They're throwing away the key/I wonder who it'll be tomorrow, Michael Jackson or me?" :)
that was also the same year Spiritualized rocked the 'New Bands' tent, 14 years into their career :)
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by nickh »

angelsighs wrote:I saw that Glastonbury set too- well, sort of. by the time we had traipsed across the site the tent was really full so we had to just sit on the grass outside and listen. I remember him changing the outro of The Red Telephone to "They're locking them up today/They're throwing away the key/I wonder who it'll be tomorrow, Michael Jackson or me?" :)
that was also the same year Spiritualized rocked the 'New Bands' tent, 14 years into their career :)
Hey that’s right! We had to walk through a pretty belligerent Pyramid Stage whilst Oasis were on to get to the New Tent. There were also grumblings in our party about having to miss Oasis for that crap (Love) and now this crap (Spiritualized)! :lol:
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LoVE

Post by BzaInSpace »

Laz69 wrote:Saw them on their second tour (no idea of the year tbh) and they were brilliant... was it not Baby Lemonade that were his backing band or something... they had the little blond headed guy playing guitar (Randal i think his name was)... a friend of mine's band (The Primary 5) supported them in the Carling Academy in Glasgow and Randal joined his band on stage and played along with them... was amazing to watch...
That was them! The guitarist was pulling out all the solos so effortlessly... Arthur looked so happy and smiled through the whole gig, I cant't remember what he said exactly between songs but there was lot of emotion and ...well, love in the room.
I seem to remember they played 'Instant Karma!' at one point.... I saw them in a small venue up in Aberdeen (Lemon Tree, also the venue for legendary Spiritualized show not long after) and following what others said it was a true life-affirming, happy gig. I think every song got a massive cheer as the first note was played :D
BzaInSpace wrote:it was a best of Love (Love Story? I forget) tape I used to have that got me into them into the first place after hearing about them everywhere as an influence in the late 90s.
Basically had choice tracks from the first three albums - stuff like the superb 'Signed DC' from the first one, I think all of the first side of Da Capo and the awesome 'Your Mind And We Belong Together'/'Laughing Stock' single. I don't think it had that many from Forever Changes right enough, just the 'well-known' songs...
redcloud wrote:Rhino Records Love Anthology, "Love Story" actually included the entire 'Forever Changes' album.
Yep, my mistake - that was a more recent thing with the dvd? A quick search through amazon reveals the album was simply called The Best of Love and indeed only has a few songs from Forever Changes.

However, as an introduction to them it couldn't be beat I think - I recall listening to that tape over and over again.

I also note that Black Beauty is supposed to feature a more R&B sound! Now I'm intrigued...
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by angelsighs »

nickh wrote:
angelsighs wrote:I saw that Glastonbury set too- well, sort of. by the time we had traipsed across the site the tent was really full so we had to just sit on the grass outside and listen. I remember him changing the outro of The Red Telephone to "They're locking them up today/They're throwing away the key/I wonder who it'll be tomorrow, Michael Jackson or me?" :)
that was also the same year Spiritualized rocked the 'New Bands' tent, 14 years into their career :)
Hey that’s right! We had to walk through a pretty belligerent Pyramid Stage whilst Oasis were on to get to the New Tent. There were also grumblings in our party about having to miss Oasis for that crap (Love) and now this crap (Spiritualized)! :lol:
well I got dragged to see Muse who aren't my bag at all, therefore missing Television- still annoys me that does!! ah the politics of festivals

I also have a distinct memory of a bloke walking around in the heat wearing a big white boiler suit, on which were scrawled names of bands in black pen- including I think, Spiritualized, amongst others like Stereolab. quite the character.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by redcloud »

It's been two years since I first posted this thread and the album is finally out (it was delayed several times). Ltd. Ed. of 5000 LP's only at the moment. I saw one the other day but it was $33. Having bought a fair amount of albums recently I have to wait for payday before I grab a copy. Looks beautiful though! Double LP, hefty booklet and comes with a d/l code. I've heard about this album since I was 17 and trading tapes with collectors across the country. Never managed to get my hands on one though.

Decent review here and a soundcloud sampler to boot:

http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/18125-black-beauty/

https://soundcloud.com/highmoonrecords/ ... ty-10-song
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by shalloboi »

redcloud wrote:It's been two years since I first posted this thread and the album is finally out (it was delayed several times). Ltd. Ed. of 5000 LP's only at the moment. I saw one the other day but it was $33. Having bought a fair amount of albums recently I have to wait for payday before I grab a copy. Looks beautiful though! Double LP, hefty booklet and comes with a d/l code. I've heard about this album since I was 17 and trading tapes with collectors across the country. Never managed to get my hands on one though.

Decent review here and a soundcloud sampler to boot:

http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/18125-black-beauty/

https://soundcloud.com/highmoonrecords/ ... ty-10-song
i also am low on funds right now, but this sounds great!
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by BzaInSpace »

Timely bump of this thread, as yesterday I played the entire Forever Changes album from start to finish for the first time in at least a few years. What an album. Me and my 9-month old son enjoyed it very much. :D
Beautifully, at this point in my listening life, some songs are only beginning to hit me properly: 'Live and Let Live'.
WOW! Must have been the bizarre lyrics that start it off that had obscured the beautiful, dark verses, the great solo ending it, the harmonies that Lennon & McCartney woulda been proud of...

The whole album is definitely something that takes repeated listening to enjoy. In my case it's taken over a decade. Lame to compare it to its contemporaries but the Beatles never recorded anything as layered, deep and ultimately as dark as this. And compared to this a lot of their contemporary music just seems so facile.

And... it's such an amazingly rich sounding record. What a pleasure to play this loud. I can think of very little other records where the recording and mixing is of such a high standard - floating delicate acoustic guitars with vocals, alongside entire string and horn sections which appear right in front of you, and the whole thing still has an otherwordly feel as well. Plus the bass sounds amazing.
:D
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by angelsighs »

yup, weird coincidence, I had Forever Changes on the other day too. I was listening to my deluxe bells and whistles version, it's got an alt. mix that sounds a bit rougher around the edges, and also loads of outtakes and stuff including studio banter (is it just me that actually really enjoys hearing a band talk and banter in the studio?). there was also a standalone single with a similar sound called Laughing Stock.
I enjoyed it although I will say I can't quite match your praise Bza.. it's a fine album but something stops me fully connecting with it.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by redcloud »

angelsighs wrote:yup, weird coincidence, I had Forever Changes on the other day too. I was listening to my deluxe bells and whistles version, it's got an alt. mix that sounds a bit rougher around the edges, and also loads of outtakes and stuff including studio banter (is it just me that actually really enjoys hearing a band talk and banter in the studio?). there was also a standalone single with a similar sound called Laughing Stock.
I enjoyed it although I will say I can't quite match your praise Bza.. it's a fine album but something stops me fully connecting with it.
The album is about loss, total disconnect and a falling descent into darkness, mental illness or going off the rails. That may be one of the reasons why some struggle to connect with it. Personally, I find its prose absolutely astonishing, haunting and deeply moving made all the better with a gorgeous soundtrack that is beautifully and intelligently composed. It is a perfect album, imho.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by BzaInSpace »

angelsighs wrote:yup, weird coincidence, I had Forever Changes on the other day too. I was listening to my deluxe bells and whistles version, it's got an alt. mix that sounds a bit rougher around the edges, and also loads of outtakes and stuff including studio banter (is it just me that actually really enjoys hearing a band talk and banter in the studio?). there was also a standalone single with a similar sound called Laughing Stock.
I enjoyed it although I will say I can't quite match your praise Bza.. it's a fine album but something stops me fully connecting with it.
I know exactly what you mean. To be honest, until two days ago I would have said the same. But something about listening to that record the other day just hit me. I've long thought it overrated to a degree, and even until fairly recently thought the comparitively straight-up Da Capo was a better record.
In the old days I would have blamed it on being wasted or whatever, but I was sitting with my boy so it was all pure and positive endorphins I was high on. Despite the records dark subject matter (see Redclouds post above - 'The Red Telephone' is at least partly about nuclear apocalypse - that first line about "Sitting on the hillside...") conversely the record is so life-affirming and joyful. Which really should be impossible. And it's all about the stuff that had never really grabbed me before - I can't get 'Live and Let Live' out of my head now. Truly astonishing. Finally, the stuff I've been reading about this record for years makes sense. An absolute masterpiece. The best album to be released in 1967?

Oh yeah - is it the 2008 double disc set on Rhino? That's the one I have also, have to say a great remaster, sounds absolutely amazing and beautiful. And to include the awesome 'Your Mind and We Belong Together' (among a load of other extras) was inspired. I first heard this on this Love compilation I mentioned a few years back and earlier on this thread...
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by redcloud »

BzaInSpace wrote:An absolute masterpiece. The best album to be released in 1967?
Arguable, for sure, but I may well side with the above. Even more astonishing when put in context with most everything else from the year. It was tackling some incredibly complex and difficult subject matter compared to most of its contemporaries.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by moop »

BzaInSpace wrote:
angelsighs wrote: Finally, the stuff I've been reading about this record for years makes sense. An absolute masterpiece. The best album to be released in 1967?
see, i never read anything about this album and maybe that's why i never quite clicked with it. I really like it, but never really got the whole 'heart of darkness' thing, because i probably paid more attention to music than to lyrics. And of course musically it's pretty uplifting. so this seems like an example of where knowing the context really helps to know the music.

having said that, I saw him at glastonbury in 2003 and hearing the music live was pretty magical. it went perfectly with lying in the sunshine with donuts and orange juice :mrgreen:

anyway, the reason for writing this, thanks to this thread I listened to the album through again today and things are definitely falling into place... I guess it's been over a decade since i first heard it, so about time I listened properly!
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by angelsighs »

BzaInSpace wrote:is it the 2008 double disc set on Rhino? That's the one I have also, have to say a great remaster, sounds absolutely amazing and beautiful. And to include the awesome 'Your Mind and We Belong Together' (among a load of other extras) was inspired. I first heard this on this Love compilation I mentioned a few years back and earlier on this thread...
yep that's the one- the remaster is really great, they did a great job and didn't just overcompress it.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by redcloud »

BzaInSpace wrote: And to include the awesome 'Your Mind and We Belong Together' (among a load of other extras) was inspired.
Speaking of that tune...have any of you guys ever seen the promo film they shot in '67? The house where they are hanging out was the same house that is featured in the old Peter Fonda psych exploito film, "The Trip".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9qKjrwD ... 7AB4E90585
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by heisenberg »

Yes! Forever Changes.

Two reasons of the many reasons I love this forum:

1) When a fellow member is currently listening to a record you yourself have recently dragged out of the vaults, and a great discussion comes about from the mutual re-listen.

2) When the aforementioned discussion has fellow board members raising the exact same great things you love about the album, or share a similar experience about their relationship with the album, and share a similar view where they feel it sits in the pantheon of great music.

For example, I love BZA's point that this is the best album of 1967, because I highlight this fact myself (probably rather too often). I love the fact someone else has said it, and in those exact words. Nice one BZA. Give me Forever Changes over Sgt Pepper any day. But then I sometimes go on to say it's the best album not of 1967, but of any year.

I've been listening to Forever Changes (and Da Capo) recently. Much like BZA and redcloud, on my initial listens of the Forever Changes album around 10 years ago I liked it a lot, but didn't quite get the hype. Anyone can love Alone Again Or, andmoreagain, The Daily Planet and recognise them to be great songs. Despite that, I use to think: was this really a 5/5 A+ album? Why isn't it quite grabbing me like I feel it should be? After many years of listening, I can definitely say Forever Changes is without doubt a classic and perhaps my favourite album of all time. I'd say it took me 6 or 7 years to properly click 100% with this album and realise just how mindblowing and untouchable it truly is. It takes a while, but I think this album (as it has done with friends of mine) seeps into you after you've been acquainted with it for a good while, and one day it hits you like a ton of bricks with its genius. You feel silly for having not seen it before.

There's been discussion here about the outtakes and alt versions of tracks, and strangely these helped win me over in realising the full potency and power of this record. How beautiful is Hummingbirds? It's an instrumental of the Good Humor Man..., with the melancholy brought to the foreground. I particularly love this song, so to hear this track was a huge treat. Also, a game-changer for me was hearing the alternative mix of You Set the Scene, where Arthur almost raps battles with himself at the outro. Is it too far-fetched to suggest this guy invented and recorded what is now known as commercial hip-hop and rap back in the mid 60s? Only to then fade it out of the final mastered versions that went on general release, and rob the world of an amazingly passionate vocal that broke ground in terms of musical genres? He was already mixing Hendrix with Byrds with Bacharach with Mariachi, perhaps inventing rap was next? Or maybe he wanted to stop breaking so much ground and let someone else have a go? Either way, for a 22 year old guy, he was immense and so full of ideas.

How can one album continue to unravel itself after years of listening? How can it continue to have such power on every spin as it were being listened to with fresh ears? Is it because (again BZA points) of the immense production, the spellbinding harmonies, the extreme undertone of darkness, the great songwriting? It's all of those things. But I also think it just has this magic to it - this perfect and nigh on unobtainable blend of being completely life-affirming and euphoric, yet scary and fearful.

As far as I'm concerned (though no other artist would likely have admitted it), this album is probably reason a lot of bands ditched the excessed of their lightweight psychedelic phases, and went back to their acoustic guitars. This band and album made the Beatles and Stones seem self-indulgent, whimsical and ignorant of the bad shit that happened to be going down in the 60s at that time. Aside from the folkies (and latterly Jimi Hendrix), no-one was tackling that stuff. By the time Lennon became political, Arthur Lee had sang about and documented that fear and paranoia three, four, five years previously and said all there was to say, as far as I am concerned. And the album flopped big time. Shameful.

I should really go back and read the rest of this thread, but aside from Forever Changes and Da Capo (and some of the s/t album), I've not heard much other stuff. Always meant to take the plunge with Four Sail and Black Beauty, but never have as of yet. Five String Serenade is also an amazing track, if anyone's missed that. I think it's early 90's vintage. Heard the album is not up to much though.

A final thing. There was some Talk Talk discussion a few months back. I love Talk Talk, and Mark Hollis' solo album. There's quite a few Love references in Talk Talk song album titles - Laughing Stock, The Daily Planet, as well as a few others that currently escape me. Given Mark Hollis' latter attitude to music, I'd imagine him to be a fan of Love. Just thought I'd throw that in as a neat little fact.

Apologies for the mega ramble. I Love Love, and I love Forever Changes.
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Re: Love-Black Beauty

Post by moop »

i'm looking forward to that 'bricks in the face' moment. some of the best albums take a lot more listens to fully connect with, but it's always worth the effort afterwards.
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L O V E

Post by BzaInSpace »

heisenberg wrote:Yes! Forever Changes.

Two reasons of the many reasons I love this forum:

1) When a fellow member is currently listening to a record you yourself have recently dragged out of the vaults, and a great discussion comes about from the mutual re-listen.

2) When the aforementioned discussion has fellow board members raising the exact same great things you love about the album, or share a similar experience about their relationship with the album, and share a similar view where they feel it sits in the pantheon of great music...
I've just spotted this outstanding post above - amazing! :D

Great being part of a bubble of enthusiasm, and I have to say that I agree with everything you say. For me, that's pretty rare... :roll: I'm with you all the way on how ahead of it's time it is. I think also what I love about this album is that it's so honest and truly from the (dark) heart of Arthur Lee. It articulates a lot of the true reality of the times as opposed to being blown out of one's mind on acid and everything being "groovy, man..."
heisenberg wrote:For example, I love BZA's point that this is the best album of 1967, because I highlight this fact myself (probably rather too often). I love the fact someone else has said it, and in those exact words. Nice one BZA. Give me Forever Changes over Sgt Pepper any day. But then I sometimes go on to say it's the best album not of 1967, but of any year....
That's pretty much what I inferred - I know who released the better album in 1967 and it definitely wasn't the Beatles.

Interesting about Talk Talk and Mark Hollis BTW - never made the connection with 'Laughing Stock' before, but I'm certain this is right!
O P 8
alienrendel23
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Re: Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

Post by alienrendel23 »

I think "Four Sail" is *almost* on a level with Forever Changes. It's a great bunch of songs that were recorded cheaply and in a great hurry. Could have been a truly great album if more time had been put into the arrangements/recording (and, frankly, if the Forever Changes lineup had played on it). Still a really good listen, though.
jack white
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Re: Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

Post by jack white »

i clicked w/FC & Love immediately. it really was love at first listen. it just made sense. i got it. the flurry & ambition, the soundtrack to the world really. it just gets it. arthur saw it & was able to transform it into a weirdly colourful, vivid doom.
but then i was p depressed & smoking a lot when i got into it which probably helped!

i know people say about the juxtaposition of arthurs lyrics & imagery and the music itself, & while i can see that in a sense i have to say it never really felt a true definition of the piece.
to me FC is sadly beautiful, absurdly so.
it's angry & desperate as opposed to uplifting or pop, tho it is sumptuous & just gorgeous to listen to. but the thread running thru it is maybe one of hope, to me it's closer to acknowledgement & closure. like somewhere between a call to arms and an eternal sigh. things could be one way but this is how they are until you take charge & even then you're going to die some way or another. a lovely summertime record(!)
take the red telephone (possibly the finest moment in arthurs entire catalogue) - the fascination with death in the lyrics is reflected in the menace of the riff & the black mania of the strings: it's a wholly bleak place to be. but the real problem & the power of the music is that it's a sign of the times & that it's still shockingly relevant today.
or take the sardonic The Good Humour Man... i can see why it's fooled people into thinking it's a little too 1967 summer of love but it's not; it paints it black - those funereal horns, the guitar melody weeping, the shattered ending... the amazing thing is to be able to twist that fury into something so quietly beautiful. but it doesn't hide its true intention, it's just that it is so easily missed given the plethora of wonderful ideas vying for attention.
& that goes for the album, it is very much a complete piece & vision. something that i don't think he attained across any of the other albums, most of which i have a soft spot for. but none are as perfect as FC, few records are imo.

in terms of Black Beauty, i've still to get my hands on this latest official copy.
ive had a dodgy rip from a bootleg version for years & it's a real gem of a rock n roll record.
there are some fierce riffs comparable to anything off the first two or Four Sail (e.g. the demented Feathered Fish) & typically dusted w/some lovely ballads (I Got to Find It).
simply it is another fabulous Love record. up there w/Four Sail for me. in fact i'd prob prefer it song-for-song to Four Sail (in fact my version has a version of Always See Your Face called Walk Right In - Always See Your Face, i don't know what happened in the linage of the album like i say i d/l'd a rip off it & w/o any liner notes etc.)


i don't think Four Sail was ever going to compare to FC fwiw. i think FS was always going to be a reaction to the arrangements of FC, he was always going in a new direction & even if he'd had the budget & time i don't think he had the material or vision to replicate the consistency & completeness of FC. i love that album tho - Dream, August, See Your Face are just gorgeous as good as anything he ever made & Singing Cowboy & Robert Montgomery are just epic fucking rock songs, the only problem w/them is they're both like 3 or 4 minutes too SHORT!
Four Sail was definitely the album he needed Jimi on.
gonna burn brightly
for a while
redcloud
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Re: Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

Post by redcloud »

^^^^ Great post Jack White! Really enjoyed reading that. Cheers!

Regarding "Four Sail"...I too think it is a very good record and should be judged on its merits and not compared to FC. Afterall, he has an entirely new band and guitarist Jay Donnellan does a fine job and for me he fits in well. "Nothing" is tremendous.

I am also a fan of "Out Here" but, I think it would have been better had they trimmed the fat and slimmed it down to a single LP. There are some very good, I would even go as far as saying masterful songs, on the LP but there are also some fluff and filler. I love the simplicity of the first part of "Doggone" but it unfortunately gets bogged down by a long tedious drum solo (same with the extended guitar solo on "Love Is More Than Words"). The electric version of "Signed D.C" though is excruciatingly emotional and far superior to the acoustic version on the 1st LP. With better editing this could have been Lee's best album post-FC.
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Re: Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

Post by Shinesalight »

Has anyone got last years reissued vinyl of Forever Changes on Rhino Records? Torn between getting that 180gm version of chancing my arm on an old vintage copy on eBay. Would like to know what the sound quality is like on the Rhino reissue...I know Rhino can be a bit hit or miss but I really like the job they did with their reissue of Ride's Nowhere LP.
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redcloud
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Re: Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

Post by redcloud »

Shines, buy an original. An original in decent nick will not break the bank. Check eBay first but, if in doubt, I see copies of that record all the time. Its high regard and reputation means they tend to sell quick tho.
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Re: Love - 'Black Beauty' & 'Forever Changes'

Post by redcloud »

I was in a record store tonight and decided that as the summer comes to an end (for me) I should finally pick this record up.

Wow! Just...wow (somewhat speechless)!

Playing it now so can't really comment on the mastering from the acetate but so far it sounds very good and the physical package is an absolute stunner! I would say that yes, this is worth every bit the $30 I paid for it. It is housed in a thick cardboard jacket with gorgeous color photo on cover, 28 page booklet (I will begin reading it as soon as I finish posting this), color inner sleeve, 180gm vinyl and download code. My LP is #1963/5000 and the record store I bought it at had probably five more copies of the LP. This really is stunning piece of work by High Moon Records. :D

Check it out:
Love.jpg
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