Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

For new sounds, old sounds and favourite sound discussion...

Moderators: sunny, BzaInSpace, runcible, spzretent

Post Reply
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by BzaInSpace »

Anybody else looking forward to this?

In a deluge of remastered/rereleased/expanded/deluxe editions there are only a few I'd really look forward to - and this is one of them. I don't care if this is the annual Geffen Nirvana Xmas Cash-Cow - In Utero remains a full twenty (!) years after it's release one of my all-time favourite LPs... if not THE favourite.

For me this was and is a very significant record - it was one of the first albums I can remember being aware of it's release and (almost) being aware of the cultural and critical importance riding on it: I was all of 14 and just getting into music at that time. I remember hearing it originally as a 3rd generation copy on cassette - somehow the additional noise and tape hiss didn't dispell from the magic I was hearing. I misheard and couldn't make out a lot of the lyrics - and it sounded much like the amazing classic punk rock stuff I'd been hearing recently, so raw and unvarnished, certainly compared to Nevermind but ironically (perhaps) it sounded so alive, so vital, and just... incredible really.

But it was the songs, and always about the songs, and it's hard to imagine and believe how long I've lived with these songs. I know it's seen as one of the darker-than-dark records like Berlin, Sister Lovers or The Holy Bible but for me it's anything but - fuck it, if I hear any of this loud then that's like a party to me. This has been played at many a party with some of my friends and for us it's truly a joyous, singalong album. I can still sing along to every note (complete with hoarseness afterwards) and anticipate every nuance and bass note and chord change/chorus/solo/bad solo and I never ever get tired of it. It sounds so full of rage and resignation and burning anger against the world, but with this beautiful (and ultimately overriding) euphoria and sense of ragged victory. At least it does to me. To me it sounds like somebody who has dredged up all the shit in their life, spat it all out and carrying on with a renewed sense of 'Fuck You'. Anything else is just history I suppose.

It probably doesn't get much better than in the middle of 'Radio Friendly Unit Shifter' where it kicks up a gear out of detuned, feedback sludge rock into this amazing, astonishing main bridge... and the lyrics! So simple, yet so profound, on some level anyway:

Hate your enemies,
Save, save your friends,
Find, find your place,
Spin, spin the truth.


So this anniversary edition is gonna kill me financially, particularly as I just quit my job and am about to go to Uni (thus knocking on the head over a decade of full-time work - YASS!). Anyway, the "super-deluxe" edition is coming in at around £80, the vinyl edition is gonna be £40... and I sorta need them both.
http://www.nirvana.com/inutero20)

Why? Basically, the CDs will have a remaster of the original album complete with the original Albini mixes of 'Heart-Shaped Box' and 'All Apologies' (although these have been bootlegged over the years) plus all the b-sides and other stuff from the Albini sessions as well as rehearsals and stuff. There is the 'Live 'N' Loud' 1993 MTV show as well in both audio and DVD, but that's not the main draw for me.

What really excites me is that there is a brand new 2013 mix of the album undertaken by none other than Steve Albini himself, with Krist Novoselic supervising. And done at Abbey Road no less! As I understand it, this is an entire 're-version' of the album, and I'm really looking forward to hearing what they've done. It's not meant to be definitive - just looking at the album from different angle apparently. For someone like me, this is bound to be pure insane trainspotter joy or heartbreak... reckon it'll be special anyway.

According to the Albini interview on this blog http://vishkhanna.com/2013/08/16/ep-24-steve-albini/ (warning - the interviewer tires me out just listening to him - I half expected Albini to rip into him but to his credit he's a great & patient interviewee) the new vinyl edition of In Utero will be cut from a copper laquer onto a double 12" at 45rpm and Albini believes it's the closest and and truest and absolutely best possible quality edition of the album - the entire thing behind this was to have absolute optimum sound quality so I'm very happy Albini has been involved with this so closely. He's also pretty disparaging of Bob Ludwig, who mastered the original edition, so I'm hoping that Steve has mastered this himself this time round, although I'm unsure. I just pray they haven't done an insanely compressed remaster and fucked the album completely (see the 2011 edition of Nevermind - they killed a great album!)

On that interview, which is well worth listening to BTW there is also a beautiful and touching moment when Albini gets righteously angry and rages very articulately against the bastards within Nirvana's management and record company that fucked around with this album way before it even came out:

"All of the people that were carping at the band from the outside about what a mistake they'd made with this record, that pretty accurately represented what they wanted to do with their music... all of those people are parasites."
"They weren't involved in making the record. They want, somehow or another, to claim authorship of the creative output of these other people who are actually doing the heavy lifting for their career. I can't have any respect for somebody like that, who's not involved in the creative process but then decides that they wanna snipe at it from the outside and manipulate people into doing things to suit them. Fuck every one of those people."


Go Steve. Anyway... this is out in a few weeks! Excited...

Image
O P 8
jadams501
Known user
Posts: 1261
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 2:51 am

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by jadams501 »

I'm a hardcore Nirvana fan and In Utero is certainly my favorite of their studio releases... a scorched, stark, uncompromising classic that instantly renders Nevermind juvenile by comparison. My favorite Nirvana live stuff is late in the game when it includes the In Utero tracks, overall Kurt's best songwriting.

That said, I am not losing sleep over the expanded rerelease. I like the acoustic takes from With The Lights Out, and like some of the b-sides and so forth, but there's a brutal poetic concision to the original 41 minute album or whatever that multiple discs of demos and rehearsals are unlikely to eclipse.

My truest experience of In Utero has been blasting it through ragged car speakers in my old '96 Mazda while roaring through the suburbs. Part of the genius of the music is that it's so visceral, and so from the margins, that it makes as much or more sense on a shitty boombox than it does a Hi-Fi. The original CD on mediocre equipment is how it sounded then, and was designed to sound, so I personally plan just to go back to my old BMG Music Club promo copy, still on my shelf after all these years.
shalloboi
Known user
Posts: 894
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:25 am
Location: chicago, il
Contact:

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by shalloboi »

i preordered the 'live and loud' dvd already- i've been hoping for a dvd release of that show since the 'nevermind' reissue came out. my friend and i used to watch his vhs copy of that mtv special over and over. it wasn't replayed on mtv that much so i never taped it myself.
davedecay
Known user
Posts: 1307
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:04 am
Location: PA, USA

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by davedecay »

I was at this show
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZFykfXfzJ0

I created a 2-cam edit from two VHS sources. This one is a 3-cam edit.

it's #3 here, and their assesment is correct; it wasn't a great edit.

http://www.livenirvana.com/digitalnirva ... ana93.html
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

Never cared for Nirvana when they were popular (aging punk rocker, been there done that, etc.). I might have to get this one - betting my kids will love it!
davedecay
Known user
Posts: 1307
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:04 am
Location: PA, USA

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by davedecay »

I played the hell out of Bleach as soon as I got it into my collection.

at age 48, i listen to some punk (today i was blasting Angry Samoans) as well as lots of other genres.

my angst has calmed down over the past 30 years. :)
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

my old man's a fatso...!
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

"Cufk, Tish, Sips"

Post by BzaInSpace »

:roll:

Er... ok.

Anyway, decided to pre-order the full 'Super Deluxe' bells 'n' whistles edition of this - really, I've gotta have it. To be fair my record purchasing this year has been extremely limited - at least to what it used to be - and pre-orders through the UK Universal site get a bonus edition of alternate Albini mixes of 'Heart-Shaped Box'. I'd rather have that than some kind of poster or keyring or whatever. Excited!
jadams501 wrote:I'm a hardcore Nirvana fan and In Utero is certainly my favorite of their studio releases... a scorched, stark, uncompromising classic that instantly renders Nevermind juvenile by comparison. My favorite Nirvana live stuff is late in the game when it includes the In Utero tracks, overall Kurt's best songwriting.
Me too! Thought there might have been some more who feel the Nirvana love, I mean that Pink Floyd thread is never-ending (just like one of their later albums!) but give me the visceral, soulful, heavy punk blues of NIRVANA anytime, anywhere.

I'll agree with most of that except I dunno if Nevermind could ever be described as juvenile - maybe parts of Bleach are a little unformed and teenage-heavy-metal (which it pretty much was) right enough. But Nevermind... maybe it's just the vocals. And the songs. And the... ah, it's incredible.

Also, I think the 1993/94 live shows (at least that I have heard via bootleg or otherwise - any thoughts Dave as you were actually there?) are by and large pretty disappointing - excellent 'career-spanning' setlists yes, but Kurt's heart is clearly not in it and I think the 'external factors' are finally taking their toll. Plus these are stadium shows, with large sections of the audience clapping along to 'Polly' (despite being requested otherwise!) and his voice is truly fucked by the 1994 shows.

I much prefer the shows from a few years earlier - there's a wild and reckless abandon in their playing (they still have something to prove!) and a good deal of humour and mutual respect present in the audience interactions...
jadams wrote:That said, I am not losing sleep over the expanded rerelease. I like the acoustic takes from With The Lights Out, and like some of the b-sides and so forth, but there's a brutal poetic concision to the original 41 minute album or whatever that multiple discs of demos and rehearsals are unlikely to eclipse...
Sort of. Remember though that the European edition of In Utero contained an addition "Devalued American Dollar Purchase Incentive Track", the epic, insane and euphoric 'Gallons of Rubbing Alcohol Flow Through The Strip' - cunningly placed 38 minutes after 'All Apologies' finished.

This 'hidden track' was particularly effective like me if you spent most of the 90s falling asleep with a pair of headphones on... I'd usually have lulled off by 'All Apologies' anyway and when this finally just kicks in it was always disorientating and scary. So that for me is the true end of this album.

Regarding the With The Lights Out set: I thought the super-rough, acoustic, boom-box recorded demos from Kurt's private stash were mostly forgettable. 'Serve the Servants' was OK. But for me the real proper material on that box was stuff like the 8 minute early demo take of 'Scentless Apprentice', the Rio studio material, the previously unreleased stuff like the bonkers 'I Hate Myself...' demo (although it was noted as being the In Utero outtake version - which it clearly wasn't!).
In fact the compilers of that box made some maddening errors in dating the songs, getting titles incorrect (especially on Disc 2) and leaving a lot of great stuff off that's out there in bootleg-land...
jadams wrote:My truest experience of In Utero has been blasting it through ragged car speakers in my old '96 Mazda while roaring through the suburbs. Part of the genius of the music is that it's so visceral, and so from the margins, that it makes as much or more sense on a shitty boombox than it does a Hi-Fi. The original CD on mediocre equipment is how it sounded then, and was designed to sound, so I personally plan just to go back to my old BMG Music Club promo copy, still on my shelf after all these years.
Sure - for X amount of years I listened to tape quality through shitty personal stereo equipment. It sounded great - of course it did! However, Steve Albini makes a point that the the quality of master>compact disc transfers have improved immeasurably since 1993 - and he feels like the new master at last does this album justice. To be honest if this was from any other record-company lackey/producer I would probably avoid this, but Steve Albini without a doubt really, sonically knows his stuff. The fact he is so behind this and very much involved means this should be awesome.

Another massive negative point against the With The Lights Out set: some of the best material on there, such as the 'Laundry Room' recordings - which were done between Nevermind and In Utero - were needlessly remixed and remastered to a hyper-compressed mess by some destructive fool called Adam Kasper. Fuck knows what he was thinking off, but the amazing stuff from those sessions like 'Oh, The Guilt' are entirely different, and sound much worse, than the originally released versions.

I think it's safe to assume this won't be happening here...

davedecay wrote:...my angst has calmed down over the past 30 years. :)
Angst?

Really? C'mon - KC even punctures this idea of 'angst' in the very first lyrics on In Utero. Angst is for, I dunno, Radiohead or something like that. Nirvana is all righteous anger and mayhem and sheer rock 'n' roll - plus they do the oft-mentioned 'Sister Ray'/'Here She Comes Now' thing really well too. Hell, they even covered the latter...
O P 8
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

Christ, we're talking about Nirvana, do you need to write a fucking book?
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by BzaInSpace »

runaway wrote:Christ, we're talking about Nirvana, do you need to write a fucking book?
Go fuck yourself - nobody is forcing you to read this.

WE'RE talking about Nirvana - YOU clearly have nothing to add here so piss off back to your Angry Samoans records, you tit.

runaway wrote:Never cared for Nirvana when they were popular (aging punk rocker, been there done that, etc)
You got the aging(sic) part right anyway grandad.
O P 8
davedecay
Known user
Posts: 1307
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:04 am
Location: PA, USA

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by davedecay »

for the record (get it?) I like Nirvana and Angry Samoans.

in Utero's harsh sound really appealed to me then as well as now.

I've had an Alternate Albini Mix since 2006, it will be interesting to compare that with what is released.

the bootleg Illiteracy Will Prevail 8 CD box has some good bits, though I only have 3 of the discs' content.
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

They saved Hitler's cock, they hid it under a rock!
redcloud
Known user
Posts: 2755
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 8:32 pm
Location: Portland, OR.

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by redcloud »

runaway wrote:Christ, we're talking about Nirvana, do you need to write a fucking book?
I'm quite amazed to read this...

As somebody who could easily be accused of "writing a book" on several occasions about particular albums or bands I would have thought good dialogue was encouraged in this forum. To read somebody's well articulated thoughts and counter arguments about art whether it be Nirvana, Pollack, Bosch or Salinger seems to me to be precisely the critical thinking that we should all be striving for. But, nobody fucking reads anymore thanks to texting, facebook, twitter etc. Book sales are down, newspapers are going out of business and kids leaving schools don't know how to write. So, why encourage that trend by suggesting that somebody who has something to say and wants to share it and who clearly knows how to write to not write so much? I don't get it and I'm somewhat speechless.

If you don't want to read it, fine. Move on. But man, enjoy the fact that there may be some higher thought going on in these pages. That is one of the reasons this forum is great and different than most.

And one final note...Thank Christ for Lester Bangs. Have you ever heard of him? Check him out sometime. There are a few books that have collected his essays, articles and writings on rock and roll. Remember, Rock and Roll is a spark and it can also be art and it should be celebrated when it moves people to THINK.
TheWarmth
Known user
Posts: 3959
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Chicago, IL
Contact:

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by TheWarmth »

Here's a good, new interview with Albini. He talks about Shellac a lot at the beginning and then move on to the In Utero reissue. I'm really psyched that it's being issued on 45rpm double vinyl. Should sound incredible.

http://chicagoist.com/2013/09/11/interv ... albini.php
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

redcloud wrote:
runaway wrote:Christ, we're talking about Nirvana, do you need to write a fucking book?
I'm quite amazed to read this...

As somebody who could easily be accused of "writing a book" on several occasions about particular albums or bands I would have thought good dialogue was encouraged in this forum. To read somebody's well articulated thoughts and counter arguments about art whether it be Nirvana, Pollack, Bosch or Salinger seems to me to be precisely the critical thinking that we should all be striving for. But, nobody fucking reads anymore thanks to texting, facebook, twitter etc. Book sales are down, newspapers are going out of business and kids leaving schools don't know how to write. So, why encourage that trend by suggesting that somebody who has something to say and wants to share it and who clearly knows how to write to not write so much? I don't get it and I'm somewhat speechless.

If you don't want to read it, fine. Move on. But man, enjoy the fact that there may be some higher thought going on in these pages. That is one of the reasons this forum is great and different than most.

And one final note...Thank Christ for Lester Bangs. Have you ever heard of him? Check him out sometime. There are a few books that have collected his essays, articles and writings on rock and roll. Remember, Rock and Roll is a spark and it can also be art and it should be celebrated when it moves people to THINK.
I still read a lot and so do my kids, but this is the internet, not a fucking library.
(btw; I read all of Bza's post, despite his initial smarmy dismissal of my Angry Samoans lyric)
TheWarmth
Known user
Posts: 3959
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Chicago, IL
Contact:

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by TheWarmth »

So, like I said, there's a cool interview with Albini ... click the link above and check it out. The reissue should sound wonderful. Really looking forward to checking it out.
johnnyboy
Known user
Posts: 929
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2007 4:39 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by johnnyboy »

BZA, have you seen this weeks NME, the In Utero Special? Quite a few words about it in there. Enough for a magazine article but not quite a book. Your post was more of an essay or a small pamphlet declaring your love for it 8) . Keep it up sir. Reading peoples passionate posts on here is a good reason to come along and check in every once in a while. Even if I don't like the band in question there might be something in the words that will make me have a re-think, or listen with new ears, or just enjoy the writing and obvious passion behind it. Jeez, we've all gushed about this and that over the years whether here or elsewhere. The Pink Floyd thread is one I've dipped into but is too in depth for me to really get involved with but I'd never think about bowling on in there to have a go at people for writing so much. Negative energy.

Carry on the good work chaps.

I did have a few days of listening to In Utero last week (the copy you did for me Bza!). Really enjoyed it but have gone into calmer waters since. My connection to the album isn't like Bza's so my own passion isn't in any way similar. I'd moved on from them by that point so only heard the album in later years. Now, I can remember buying the Sliver/Dive green vinyl 7" in Our Price on Southend High Street though. That got played to death.
runcible
Site Admin
Posts: 5443
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Yorkshire, England

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runcible »

runaway wrote:I still read a lot and so do my kids, but this is the internet, not a fucking library.
Something told me about this thing called 'Twitter' where you can't write very much.

That seems more your thing if you prefer to restrict how much someone is allowed to post. :roll:
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

"I'm Very Ape / And Very Nice"

Post by BzaInSpace »

runaway wrote:I read all of Bza's post, despite his initial smarmy dismissal of my Angry Samoans lyric...
Hey I'm impressed.

"Smarmy"...you've got to be kidding me. For what it's worth, I didn't even 'get' the Angry Samoans lyric or the relevance - what THE FUCK do those random quotes have to with the topic anyway?
runaway wrote:I still read a lot... but this is the internet, not a fucking library.
Reading includes more than just the leaflet with your meds and the back of the cornflakes box.

Fuck you - I'll write what I want on here: it's the internet, as you correctly surmise.

If what I write irritates know-nothing, say-nothing, negative, trolling sad-sacks like yourself then all the better. There's places like Twitter that might be better suited for ya - I take it you do have a character limit with each post?

Fucking hell. :shock:
TheWarmth wrote:Here's a good, new interview with Albini. He talks about Shellac a lot at the beginning and then move on to the In Utero reissue. I'm really psyched that it's being issued on 45rpm double vinyl. Should sound incredible.

http://chicagoist.com/2013/09/11/interv ... albini.php
That's more like it - great article, cheers Paul. Much easier to digest than that podcast thing I heard.

This:
Steve Albini wrote:The 1993 version of the record was somewhat constrained by the mastering technology of the time. Digital mastering was in its infancy then, so there were a lot of presumptions made about how you should approach a CD that proved incorrect over time. The CD master was made with certain sonic characteristics in mind that were probably standard practice at the time, but in the long term turned out to be not beneficial. The LP was limited by certain restrictions on the abilities of mastering techniques that were used. This is kind of a complicated technical discussion, but most records are mastered by cutting a master lacquer disc. The lacquer has certain limitations on its capabilities, such as the side lengths are limited. If the side lengths get longer than about 18 or 20 minutes then you start compromising the sound quality in order to fit the program material. In Utero was a long record; the side lengths were 22-24 minutes as I recall. Mastering it into lacquer implied certain limitations on the sound quality. You couldn’t get full frequency response, you couldn’t get full dynamic range, things like that....
For the new deluxe edition the mastering has been done into copper discs, that’s called Direct Metal Mastering. That gives you better immediate fidelity but also it removes a few of those limitations on side length, overall volume, perceived sound quality, bass response, dynamic range, and things like that...
The side lengths do still impinge somewhat on some of the sound quality considerations. If you split the record up into four 12-inch 45 rpm sides rather than two 33 rpm LP sides then you no longer have those constraints on program length. You can then have full frequency response and full dynamic range even with a long program, because you split it up onto four sides. That’s an extraordinary step. It’s not commonly done, and it would be nice if it were done more often because it is a really terrific format for sound quality....
In a lot of mastering the LP will be cut from a digital file that will be created in a mastering studio that incorporates whatever tone changes were requested during the mastering. So create a master digital file, that file will be used to cut the LP and will also be used as the CD master. On the deluxe edition of In Utero the LP discs, that is the proper masters, were cut from the original master tapes or the same tapes that were played in the studio when we were making the record. That’s an unusual step and an extraordinary step these days, because it’s somewhat risky to send your original priceless master tapes off to be worked on in an external studio. It does ensure that you have the absolute best sound quality if you’re working from the original master tapes rather than a digital transfer...

I can say that if you get the new deluxe edition double 12-inch 45 vinyl version of Nirvana’s In Utero that is as good as records can be made.


Magic!

(All) Apologies (except to Runaway) if that verged on the sheer technical muso obsessiveness - me, I'm fascinated by all that. Like I said before I think the fact that Albini is so much behind this will make for an extremely high quality reproduction.
The vinyl edition will be a great xmas present I reckon... :wink:

Johnny - cheers mate and good to hear from you. There is still a PM in my outbox for you by the way - check it out. The link has probably expired so give me a shout if you still want it...

Look, there's another chapter of my fucking BOOK Runaway - happy now?

Image
O P 8
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by BzaInSpace »

Aha! Runcie beat me with the Twitter observation... :lol:

Nevermind all that anyway - listen to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YZZiIlJHVA


Mislabeled on the box-set, but whoever posted this really knows their stuff. Sheer feedback strewn lurching mayhem with some kind of twisted pop song at it's core. Beautiful!
O P 8
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

Oh Bza, maybe you should just chill, I was only taking the piss.

Put a pen in your hand, poke your eyes out
I can't see too well, what's it all about?
spzretent
Site Admin
Posts: 5587
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Motor City

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by spzretent »

Runaway. Are you passionate about anything?
Some of your greatest moments on this message board:
Green Pajamas thread after many were posting about how much we loved them.
runaway wrote:
Not feeling it. Listened to a bunch of their songs on YouTube and I had to wash my ears out with some Yo La Tengo.

Later in same thread:
runaway wrote:
And Lester Bangs was right: the MC5 sucked balls.

Lets move on to the Kenny Tudrick thread.
runaway wrote;
Unfortunate name, though.

yet another great pearl of wisdom.

So you seem to take delight in ripping into band or threads people get passionate about with snippy one liners and never once giving an opinion why. Do you really wonder why you elicit such negative responses from people who post here?
As one founding members of Spacemen 3 once quipped to me me "Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit".
Time for me to pass it on.
http://www.lilmoxie.com
Detroit, Music, Sports and Other Stuff(including Spiritualized, Spacemen 3)
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

I'm passionate about:
Link Wray
The New York Dolls
Mink Deville
The Kinks

Not so much about:
The Green Pajamas
Nirvana
The MC5
U2
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

More passion for:

Scott Walker
The Beach Boys
The Fall
Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds
Townes Van Zandt
The 13th Floor Elevators
The Ramones
Chameleons
The Cramps
spzretent
Site Admin
Posts: 5587
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Motor City

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by spzretent »

runaway wrote:More passion for:

Scott Walker
The Beach Boys
The Fall
Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds
Townes Van Zandt
The 13th Floor Elevators
The Ramones
Chameleons
The Cramps
Why not post about them? Surely more constructive.
http://www.lilmoxie.com
Detroit, Music, Sports and Other Stuff(including Spiritualized, Spacemen 3)
redcloud
Known user
Posts: 2755
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 8:32 pm
Location: Portland, OR.

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by redcloud »

runaway wrote: this is the internet, not a fucking library.
Poor excuse. As there are many people who spend a lot of time reading on the internet it seems to me that there is even more of a reason to instill better, more involved writing to help engage its readers and promote literacy.

Anybody can write a simple fucking sentence but not everybody can write an essay.
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

spzretent wrote:
runaway wrote:More passion for:

Scott Walker
The Beach Boys
The Fall
Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds
Townes Van Zandt
The 13th Floor Elevators
The Ramones
Chameleons
The Cramps
Why not post about them? Surely more constructive.
I have. Lately any mention of anything other than Ty Seagall or the latest psych flavor-of-month is met with indifference by the five or six who dominate this forum. I've been a member here since the beginning and am lamenting times when things were less insular and others weren't so sensitive.
Yes, I am a bitter person.


And I hate Eric Clapton.
spzretent
Site Admin
Posts: 5587
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Motor City

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by spzretent »

I dunno. Bitter or not if you post like an asshole your are gonna get called out here. There is no forum domination. Yes, some of us have posted a lot more than others. Thats not to stop anyone else from posting.
Take Hofstadter. This guy is a freshman in college and has posted some of the most intelligent and insightful posts on this message board in eons. He clearly wasn't intimidated. Wasn't worried about "domination". He was welcomed with open arms. And there are others who clearly have their finger on the pulse of whats going on musically. The Warmth, Shinesalight, Sunray, Shalloboi, Davedecay, Marcvolta, Angelsighs, Laz69, Tomilk, Olan, Niamhm, MC, Aquarian Time, Ro, James T etc.
http://www.lilmoxie.com
Detroit, Music, Sports and Other Stuff(including Spiritualized, Spacemen 3)
pale blue eyes
Known user
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:27 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by pale blue eyes »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oB1vb1Q7Qr8


as for nirvana, saw them in a tiny place, wasn't really into them. honestly i don't think anybody was. was amazed when they exploded. knew they would implode, i mean they had to. avoided them for ages until a friend gave me a copy of In Utero and i thought it was brilliant.



p/s- i took a few years off from coming round here cause of comments like that. it was completely uncalled for and totally moronic. we don't need another muscles...(and no offense to muscles because at least most of his abuse included heavy doses of sarcasm and humor).
spzretent
Site Admin
Posts: 5587
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Motor City

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by spzretent »

This era Link Wray changed my life.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfk6UAou77o
http://www.lilmoxie.com
Detroit, Music, Sports and Other Stuff(including Spiritualized, Spacemen 3)
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

I liked every Link era. One of the first albums I ever bought as a kid was Fresh Fish Special with Robert Gordon.

http://youtu.be/TBvj3NkVp4M
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Give Me A Leonard Cohen Afterworld So I Can Sigh Eternally..

Post by BzaInSpace »

Way off topic now.
runaway wrote: Lately any mention of anything other than Ty Seagall or the latest psych flavor-of-month is met with indifference by the five or six who dominate this forum. I've been a member here since the beginning and am lamenting times when things were less insular and others weren't so sensitive...
World's smallest violin...

C'mon man, that's rubbish - Ty Seagull and that has little appeal to me either, what am I gonna do? We could sit and cry together, and derail others threads...

Nah. I've posted many a thing that might have one or two replies if I'm lucky - more often none at all. So? It's the internet. Somebody might read it someday. Somebody might not. Somebody might read it and not comment. Somebody might read it and not comment but by a record as a recommendation. It's all good - post count means nothing! :wink:

You can't worry about that stuff. I'll keep posting about Primal Scream, knowing it'll get short shrift from Runcible, or enthusing about some Prince 90s outtakes to... silence.

Seriously though, some years back this forum was a seething mass of anonymous guests, anonymous abuse, bottomless grudges, hatred and innuendo with the occasional nugget of wisdom strewn through it.
And of course twentysixdollars. I was there too. Rose tinted specs maybe?

And sensitive? Hey, I just give a shit.
runaway wrote: Scott Walker
The Beach Boys
The Fall
Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds
Townes Van Zandt
The 13th Floor Elevators
The Ramones
Chameleons
The Cramps
Pretty sure all of those artists have been spoken about at length on here in the past, although some like Nick Cave, The Cramps, the Elevators and the Beach Boys probably more than others. Obviously, feel free to start up a new thread should you wish.

And yes. The Link Wray 'Three Track Shack' era of music is some of the best music in the world. Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLXhUIRZ2d4

That stuff has been mentioned on here a lot - can't recall your words of enthusiasm for that either.
runaway wrote:And I hate Eric Clapton.
Well at least we can agree on something.

And now... back to the GREATEST ROCK AND ROLL BAND EVER! :twisted:
O P 8
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

tourette's

Post by BzaInSpace »

O P 8
heisenberg
Known user
Posts: 423
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:14 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by heisenberg »

Just out of curiosity, is anyone else aside from BZA investing the vinyl and/or super deluxe set? I'd really like the super deluxe set, but £80 is slightly too steep for me (as was Nevermind). Also considering a friend of mine is the biggest Nirvana freak, I already have so many of the (previously) hidden Nirvana treasures already. I am interested in the original Albini mixes though, I must say.

BZA, did you buy the Nevermind Super Deluxe set? I know you weren't keen on the '2011' version of the album. If you did buy the set, was it worth £80? My mate said suspiciously little about the Nevermind rerelease, which I took as a mild disappointment which he wasn't too keen to acknowledge. I gather from your posts you prefer In Utero anyway, though I'm just curious your views on the Nevermind rerelease package on the eve of In Utero's rerelease.

And this thread has put me in the mood to put In Utero again. I will do so when I get the appropriate time and peace to properly listen.
Last edited by heisenberg on Fri Sep 13, 2013 1:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
pale blue eyes
Known user
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:27 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by pale blue eyes »

spzretent wrote:This era Link Wray changed my life.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfk6UAou77o

me too! honestly i can care less about his rockabilly era, to me this is a thousand times more exciting. and shamefully ignored by FM rock radio!
pale blue eyes
Known user
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:27 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by pale blue eyes »

ps. - sorry BZA for the slight hijacking of the thread...
spzretent
Site Admin
Posts: 5587
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Motor City

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by spzretent »

Any love the Link Wray- Three Track Shack era gets is ok with me and i'm pretty sure Bza.
Especially after all the other bs in this thread :evil:
http://www.lilmoxie.com
Detroit, Music, Sports and Other Stuff(including Spiritualized, Spacemen 3)
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Milk it

Post by BzaInSpace »

heisenberg wrote:BZA, did you buy the Nevermind Super Deluxe set? I know you weren't keen on the '2011' version of the album. If you did buy the set, was it worth £80? My mate said suspiciously little about the Nevermind rerelease, which I took as a mild disappointment which he wasn't too keen to acknowledge. I gather from your posts you prefer In Utero anyway, though I'm just curious your views on the Nevermind rerelease package on the eve of In Utero's rerelease...
Hi, I only ever bothered with the double 'Deluxe Edition' digipack thing for the Nevermind 20th to be honest. I don't think I missed much either - there was even a good bit of photos and artwork included in that edition too - although I think there was a book with the 'Super Deluxe' set?

Ultimately, they fucked with the original albums overall mastering and sound - it sounded amazing anyway! I don't even believe it really needed a remaster - possibly a slight volume increase but 'they' compressed the shit out of it. This was the first modern remaster that I actually noticed becoming uncomfortable to listen to, at least through headphones anyway. Horrible, digital fuzziness at the edge of everything.

Disc 2 was only half good: the original Smart sessions that were basically the bootlegged demos going round in the post Bleach years are great, and great to hear in proper fidelity. However 'The Boombox Demos' are, as their name suggests, very rough and poor quality for me worth only a cursory listen, and I think for 'historical' relevance only.

One of my Nirvana loving mates (you can imagine the kind of parties we used to have...) got the whole box so I obtained a CDR of Disc 3 with Butch Vig's original 'Devonshire' mixes of the album, pretty good to hear that too. Essentially though, was it worth another $60 for? No.

The Live at the Paramount gig I wasn't bothered by particularly as it always was going to appear as a stand alone show and half the gig had been culled as Nevermind era b-sides anyway, which were also included as extra tracks on Disc 1.
This meant that if you got the full box, you're getting the same live tracks replicated three times - as b-sides on Disc 1, Live at the Paramount CD on Disc 4 and once more on the DVD of said gig!

Value...

I do sorta wish I got the vinyl edition as it was on double 45rpm 12", but if the mastering is anything like the CD, forget it!
Last edited by BzaInSpace on Wed Nov 06, 2013 6:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Clarification, innit.
O P 8
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by BzaInSpace »

:D :D :D :D

ARRIVED THIS MORNING!

A week early - clearly some kind of bonus for the faithful/hardcore. Superb looking artifact, this is a thing of beauty. All in a chunky 12" style box, with a hardback book that slides out. Already given the '2013 Albini Mix' a spin at considerable volume - beautiful and bizarre hearing this alt. version, the drums sound even tastier!

Looking forward to immersing myself this weekend...
O P 8
shalloboi
Known user
Posts: 894
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:25 am
Location: chicago, il
Contact:

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by shalloboi »

BzaInSpace wrote::D :D :D :D

Already given the '2013 Albini Mix' a spin at considerable volume - beautiful and bizarre hearing this alt. version, the drums sound even tastier!

Looking forward to immersing myself this weekend...
fantastic! i was listening to 'in utero' a few years ago and marveling at how great it sounded, but then i couldn't help but wonder how it would've sounded had it been recorded by albini at electrical audio now as he's been churning out some recordings of astonishing quality over the past few years. pretty excited to hear this new mix in light of that- in the interview they were saying there was a lot more space in the new mix and on the new vinyl version.
davedecay
Known user
Posts: 1307
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:04 am
Location: PA, USA

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by davedecay »

someone has already posted a vinyl rip online, i was looking at the track listing.

I found some photos of the covers & labels, too.

http://imgur.com/a/dy3KG/
yangen
Known user
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 7:28 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by yangen »

I received my superdeluxe edition yesterday and I have to say that this is a very nice item. I would recommend it to those who have any interest to In Utero, especially since mastering is great this time and 2013 Albini remix is excellent imo. Live and Loud concert remix is debatable though, I still prefer the old one so far. Some of the track remixes are also different but not better than old ones I think (especially b-sides).
I have the whole weekend to delve into this great boxset!
jack white
Known user
Posts: 1710
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2004 11:29 pm
Location: Tralfamadore

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by jack white »

I have very bad posture.
gonna burn brightly
for a while
niamhm
Known user
Posts: 1894
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2009 9:07 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by niamhm »

davedecay wrote:someone has already posted a vinyl rip online, i was looking at the track listing.

I found some photos of the covers & labels, too.

http://imgur.com/a/dy3KG/
f#ck!! why an I impressed by those record labels?? :?
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

"Doll Steak, Test Meat"

Post by BzaInSpace »

Not sure where to post this - here is as good as any maybe. Also timely in that having had a month or so to digest this amazing set... full reportage shit coming soon! Especially for you Runaway... :wink:

Anyway. One of my mates is a keen Twitter follower - don't hold that against him though...

He sent me this screengrab recently which showed the current listening recommendations of one Frances Bean Cobain...
IMG_1462 r.png
IMG_1462 r.png (66.09 KiB) Viewed 6319 times
Note the shout out for 'These Blues' too...

Looking at the replies posted, it seems that even the daughter of Kurt Cobain & Courtney Love isn't immune from the kind of person who immediately posts "not as good as lazer guided melodies" and then, in a further miniature pissing competition entry:
"...neither are a patch on Spacemen 3 - Recurring". :oops:
O P 8
TheWarmth
Known user
Posts: 3959
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Chicago, IL
Contact:

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by TheWarmth »

I'll take Pure Phase over Recurring any day.
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by BzaInSpace »

Me too.

And in the spirit of those dumb replies to that tweet,

I'll take Pure Phase over anything by Spacemen 3.


(I await the howls of anguish from some corners... :wink: )
O P 8
mc
Known user
Posts: 984
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by mc »

I'll take Pure Phase over pretty much any other album you could care to mention! As far as I'm concerned, PP and LGM represent the pinnacle of Spacemen 3 related music, and indeed music in general :D
jack white
Known user
Posts: 1710
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2004 11:29 pm
Location: Tralfamadore

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by jack white »

cool. good to get young people to proselytize something so valuable.

need to get miley on board next..


didn't know they were on spotify tho.. dunno how i feel about that..
gonna burn brightly
for a while
heisenberg
Known user
Posts: 423
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:14 pm

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by heisenberg »

I'll take Pure Phase over anything by Spacemen 3, anything else by Spiritualized, anything by Nirvana, and anything by Hole :lol:

I see Pure Phase as a kind of lost, secret album. Am I being naive? I feel like it rarely gets its due, but I prefer it that way. Most hacks jump from the perfect prescription straight to L&G, and don't listen to anything else in between (or before or after). Not being a snobby purist, but I hate the idea of the hipsters getting a hold of pure phase. Hope baby Cobain keeps it away from her deranged, botoxed-to-fuck mother. It has to be said, any shit that comes out that woman's mouth these days is horrendous. Or maybe she'll have a huge chapter devoted to her love for Pure Phase in her upcoming memoir.
runcible
Site Admin
Posts: 5443
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Yorkshire, England

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runcible »

BzaInSpace wrote:I'll take Pure Phase over anything by Spacemen 3.
...or anything by Primal Scream for that matter... :wink:
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by BzaInSpace »

Couldn't agree more... Pure Phase beats just about everything.
O P 8
jack white
Known user
Posts: 1710
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2004 11:29 pm
Location: Tralfamadore

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by jack white »

PP for me is a weird one in the oeuvre. the unpolished gem. its tracklist today reads like a greatest hits of the band - medication, these blues, lbits, slide song, electric mainline & the two closing numbers.. - i suppose you could inc So Hot also, given it's like one of the greatest spacemen songs.

but it does feel overlong & a little scattershot. those are maybe part of the charm as well i can see that. it's a gorgeous journey thru it.

but one thing i've learned is i'm not good at separating or ranking my favourite albums. i'm kinda grateful for them all & have uses for them all. different times & days call for different things i guess.
i couldn't say for definite it's my favourite spacemen release or like my 3rd favourite spz album. i'm just thankful i've experienced it & it's there for me should i wish to indulge.
it's a bit heavy work for a throw on & listen, it doesn't have that immediacy running thruout. i mean a lot of great records are like that & have to be reserved for their own time, again i can see that being part of it's charm.


but it is nice it gets attn from relatively unlikely sources & hopefully it & the spacemen touch a few more people as a result of that kinda exposure.
gonna burn brightly
for a while
BzaInSpace
Site Admin
Posts: 3864
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: HELL

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by BzaInSpace »

jack white wrote:PP for me is a weird one in the oeuvre. the unpolished gem. its tracklist today reads like a greatest hits of the band - medication, these blues, lbits, slide song, electric mainline & the two closing numbers.. - i suppose you could inc So Hot also, given it's like one of the greatest spacemen songs.

but it does feel overlong & a little scattershot. those are maybe part of the charm as well i can see that. it's a gorgeous journey thru it.

but one thing i've learned is i'm not good at separating or ranking my favourite albums. i'm kinda grateful for them all & have uses for them all. different times & days call for different things i guess.
i couldn't say for definite it's my favourite spacemen release or like my 3rd favourite spz album. i'm just thankful i've experienced it & it's there for me should i wish to indulge.
it's a bit heavy work for a throw on & listen, it doesn't have that immediacy running thruout. i mean a lot of great records are like that & have to be reserved for their own time, again i can see that being part of it's charm.


but it is nice it gets attn from relatively unlikely sources & hopefully it & the spacemen touch a few more people as a result of that kinda exposure.
THIS ^

Back in 1997, as Ladies and gentlemen... had yet to appear in the shops (probably due to the Elvis estate thing), and enticed by this big article and review in the NME that week, Pure Phase was the first thing I found by them in the local library. Had it not been for that article which listed previous releases - including all the early singles - I might never have checked it out. "Electric Mainline" moniker too.

It took a long time to get into, but something kept making me return to it. Bear in mind this was on a used tape format. I knew it sounded very different from anything else (and not just the incredible dual-mono mix) but something in the gorgeous build-ups through 'Medication', those deliciously wasted sounding horns, the pure drugged-out sound leading towards that final killer MC5 freak-out, which just went on and on and on getting progressively louder and more unhinged...

Fucking awesome. To this day, that song is big high point for me in the history of recorded sound, yeah definitely. I'd love to hear them do it live. And as much as I like the 12" version, the album take is the real deal for me.

And... following this, straight into narcotic lullaby mode, so tender and chilled, then into pure NOISE insanity, wow! What a trip. And that's only three tracks in.

Like Jack I hope a few people get into that record because of Frances. It deserves at least the accolades that have been showered on Ladies and gentlemen... through the years. Well, maybe not the quote about gardening from Guy Garvey I've seen a lot, but you know what I mean... :wink:

Would make an awesome reissue with alt. mixes and stuff too.

Possibly not the Spiritualized album for driving with, but definitely one for the full immersive experience, sounds unearthly through headphones...

---


Anyway - did anybody else get the In Utero set and enjoy it - or not?
O P 8
TheWarmth
Known user
Posts: 3959
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: Chicago, IL
Contact:

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by TheWarmth »

I'm still planning on getting the 3xLP In Utero set, but I haven't gotten around to it yet.
runaway
Known user
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Location: the shadows

Re: Nirvana - 'In Utero' 20th Anniversary...

Post by runaway »

My kids want it - they're 11 and 13.
Post Reply