Outpatients Jazz Club

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angelsighs
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Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Tue Oct 27, 2015 7:45 pm

There comes a time in every man's life (and it is usually men!) where his thoughts turn to jazz. like most rock fans, I took tentative steps into the catalogue of Miles Davis a little while ago (I assume Kind of Blue is still the best-selling jazz album and the token one most rock fans have on their shelf?), but just recently I've been getting deeper into jazz. there's just something so pure about abstract, improvised music sometimes.
I've found I have to step carefully though- I know any genre you can care to name has just as much crap as gold but I've found this particularly true with jazz. or it may be that I'm just a bit fussy. I think I'm leaning more towards the fiery free jazz side of things rather than the cool, laid back stuff. I think I prefer it with a bit of electricity too, both literally and figuratively.

of course there's also the place where the edges blur into jazz fusion, or avant-rock, improv rock, noise, or whatever you want to call it. once you start going deeper into the freaky side of psych and jam sessions, you almost breakthrough into jazz. are The Grateful Dead jazz? are Can? are Soft Machine?

one random and rather sweeping observation- jazz is usually produced and engineered beautifully, with a natural room sound and great tones. rock could learn a lot from that.

anyway I thought it would be good to have an all purpose jazz thread as I know there are a lot of knowledgable types round these parts. gonna post some thoughts on some of my favourites when I get round to it, but if anyone else has got a 'starter for 10'..

oh and by the by (and on a tangential Spiritualized connection), remember those beautifully packaged Treader releases by John Coxon et al? I thought they were no more but there were some new releases a couple of years back so they haven't gone totally off the radar!
http://www.treader.org/
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plastic37
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by plastic37 » Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:10 pm

I found a Chris Barber Live At Birmingham Town Hall record for a few quid. Had to buy it just for the cover and its historical aura...
Have since brought more Chris Barber stuff for a quid a disc.
I will start taking punts on the rest of the stuff in that one pound box.
They are really nice records. Sound and look fantastic.
A long as its ex/vg, has a groovy cover and is 1-2 quid i'll buy it. Eg, i saw a really nice Chris Barber/Lonnie Donnegan record but it was £4 - so i left it.

Many years ago i saw Derek Bailey play at The Jazz Vortex in North London. An evening i'll never forget. He was supported by a guy doing tap dancing - just him and his shoes and a bit of inter song banter.

Am sure my trip to New Orleans has played a part in a great appreciation of Jazz. Also realising that Woody Allen's films are full of it without it ever properly registering...
I've had the Radio Days soundtrack LP for years.

Here's a bit of Barber for you from the aforementioned LP.
Heavy Tourism

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by plastic37 » Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:12 pm

angelsighs wrote:
one random and rather sweeping observation- jazz is usually produced and engineered beautifully, with a natural room sound and great tones. rock could learn a lot from that.
That's certainly the case on the jazz records i own.
Heavy Tourism

angelsighs
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:33 pm

ah Derek Bailey! I've tried a bit of him, very unique acoustic guitar playing! fractured, explosive, almost percussively hitting the guitar at points
what would be a good album to start with him?

one other guy I tried that I would put in the same category is Bill Orcutt. he does electric guitar too but I found his acoustic guitar playing to have a lot of similar qualities. there's an album called A History Of Everyone which is his reinterpretations of old standards. easy listening it is not!

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:34 pm

oh and also, re: Treader- I emailed none other than John Coxon himself and he replied right back! most of the back catalogue still in stock and new release hopefully ready by Christmas.

olan
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by olan » Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:38 pm

I bought a fairly large collection of jazz and classical LPs about a year ago for a bargain price. In the end I kept some of the jazz (Parker, Davis, Coltrane, Davis and Coltrane etc) and some modern classical (e.g. Martinu) but most of the collection ended up at the local Oxfam. This was largely because the records were in less than pristine condition :cry: . I have found Spotify to be a brilliant way to learn a bit about jazz without the hassle of actually finding software that will play.

The Oxfam actually made quite a bit of money out of selling my cast-offs so everyone was a winner :D

ro
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by ro » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:14 am

angelsighs wrote:There comes a time in every man's life (and it is usually men!) where his thoughts turn to jazz.
Oh, but lots of females into all kinds of jazz! Like me and most of my gal (and guy) friends. It can be such a fine line sometimes anyway...
And lots of females making jazz these days... and naturally I can't think of any just now.

A funny story of a friend moving house: she & her husband packed up their extensive record collection, then set aside a big pile of "free jazz" "out there" or "skronk", whatever name you choose, to get them trough their crucial last days of packing. On the final night they threw a party and those were the only records available... not all the guests were pleased :|
This same friend said some magical quote which I can't fully recall because we were a bit drunk, but was regarding 1950s-1960s era American scene (big generalization there, sorry) and was something like:
"I've just recently begun to get into rock n roll... I've always leaned toward the Jazz because it automatically invites you in. With rock n roll, you have to knock first and then you're invited in. But I'm really beginning to like it!"
Really beautiful thing to say, I thought.

What a vast and varied genre. It'd be neat to make a timeline of the evolution. A taxonomy! Actually, that'd be pushing limitations, pigeonholes and parameters on stuff, which of course is not what a lot of jazz is sprung from. History always fun, though.
I'm not super knowledgeable so I've really nothing to contribute, except that I look forward to checking in on this thread.
Last edited by ro on Wed Oct 28, 2015 7:25 am, edited 9 times in total.

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by ro » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:16 am

angelsighs wrote:oh and also, re: Treader- I emailed none other than John Coxon himself and he replied right back! most of the back catalogue still in stock and new release hopefully ready by Christmas.
Great news, thank you.
I wonder if Evan Parker with birds is still available.

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by ro » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:23 am

angelsighs wrote:Bill Orcutt
...who I believe just put something out with the bombshell lineup of Corsano, Flaherty and Bill Nace?

Will fact-check that...
aaaand it's Alan Bishop! not Paul Flaherty and Nace.
Bombshells, all of 'em, anyway.
Moore & Moloney project: http://threelobed.bandcamp.com/album/parallelogram-3
and
http://threelobed.com/tlr/parallelogram.html

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Wed Oct 28, 2015 9:40 am

Corsano is an amazing drummer! he seems to be popping up on a lot of freejazz stuff I enjoy.
I've seen him play as part of Rangda and Flower-Corsano Duo- mesmerising!

because the jazz scene seems to be very incestuous, that's a good way to navigate it- find names of players you enjoy and follow the threads.
(that's another difference from the rock world- instead of bands having set lineups where 'splitting up' is some kind of big deal, it's basically made up of individuals and membership is more fluid. jazz cats will play with anyone! which kind of gives a lie to the impression that jazz is snobbish)

angelsighs
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Wed Oct 28, 2015 10:27 am

ro wrote:
angelsighs wrote:oh and also, re: Treader- I emailed none other than John Coxon himself and he replied right back! most of the back catalogue still in stock and new release hopefully ready by Christmas.
Great news, thank you.
I wonder if Evan Parker with birds is still available.
JC seems to suggest that most/all are in stock. only £10 each!
one of the recent releases is from what is described as the 'penultimate' Spring Heel Jack gig, which unfortunately suggests they are no more!

The Dr
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by The Dr » Wed Oct 28, 2015 4:12 pm

angelsighs wrote:
ro wrote:
angelsighs wrote:oh and also, re: Treader- I emailed none other than John Coxon himself and he replied right back! most of the back catalogue still in stock and new release hopefully ready by Christmas.
Great news, thank you.
I wonder if Evan Parker with birds is still available.
JC seems to suggest that most/all are in stock. only £10 each!
one of the recent releases is from what is described as the 'penultimate' Spring Heel Jack gig, which unfortunately suggests they are no more!
hi -

i’m sorry but i’ve sold out of that one

best
john coxon

On 28 Oct 2015,

Hello

I am interested in ordering Evan Parker with birds. Could you tell me how it is done please?


Thank you
“You're not Dostoevsky,' said the citizeness

'Well, who knows, who knows,' he replied.

'Dostoevsky's dead,' said the citizeness, but somehow not very confidently.

'I protest!' Behemoth exclaimed hotly. 'Dostoevsky is immortal!”

angelsighs
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Wed Oct 28, 2015 5:40 pm

that's a shame! I think that was the very first release though so makes sense it's gone.

tonight I ordered these:

TRD8 Amplified Trio
TRD10 Spaceshipp
TRD21 Spukhafte Fernwirkung

ro
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by ro » Wed Oct 28, 2015 7:16 pm

Hey thanks for doing that legwork, Dr!

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by ro » Thu Oct 29, 2015 12:43 am

I guess this should be in "gigs" but since we're on the subject..
https://www.cafeoto.co.uk/events/okkyun ... marclay-l/

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Tue Nov 03, 2015 9:05 am

my first choice which I can't recommend enough..

Kieran Hebden / Steve Reid / Mats Gustafsson: Live At The South Bank (2011)


This album is a live recording captured in the foyer of the South Bank Centre (which is giving me visions of a Dreamweapon type situation where people are wondering through and being either bemused or entranced accordingly!)
it''s Keiren Hebden (aka Four Tet) on electronics, Steve Reid on drums and Mats Gustafsson on sax.

with jazz, usually I accept that there are going to be meandering parts where my attention wonders, but it's worth it when it comes together in the transcendent parts (I've just kind of accepted it as a inherent hazard of a genre which is exploratory by nature), but there's something about this album that holds my attention all the way through (and it's 2CDs!).
I think one factor is that Hebden is generating so many different sounds and textures with his laptop. he's not limited in terms of the sounds he can generate- whereas unless you are using a lot of effects pedals (the usage of which I think seems to divide opinion in jazz?) you are limited by the tones you can get. Hebden is providing so many twist and turns in terms of the soundworld here, and the other players are totally feeding off it.
apparently some of the loops he is using are elements of Four Tet songs, but I'm not that familiar with them, and infact I don't generally care for electronic music in general- but the stuff he's doing here sounds so organic.

the opening piece 'Morning Prayer' is relatively calm, just the electronics and drums feeling it out. apparently Mats was standing at the side of the stage, so mesmerised by the chemistry already on display that he just watched for a bit and struggled to find a point to enter with sax!
there's a point on the second disc where a big loop starts swirling and Mats starts wailing with these long notes on the sax, it's like being sucked into another dimension!

heisenberg
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by heisenberg » Tue Nov 03, 2015 10:49 am

http://youtu.be/uCymAH6r2Tc

Loving this thread. But had to post this in reference to the original post picture.

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Wed Nov 04, 2015 9:58 am

heisenberg wrote:http://youtu.be/uCymAH6r2Tc

Loving this thread. But had to post this in reference to the original post picture.
superb! :D

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:24 pm

Last Exit - Last Exit (1986)

quite the personnel involved here:
Sonny Sharrock- guitar
Bill Laswell- bass
Peter Brotzmann- saxophone
Ronald Shannon Jackson- drums

apparently this is a live album, but it sounds very studio to me. there's no crowd noise or anything. I guess the division between live and studio in jazz is pretty moot anyway (unless you are talking about a Bitches Brew situation).
this is jazz fusion, but not in a hippy sixties tie dye noodling way. it's pure noisy shit at times! it gets pretty ferocious. there's the power of rock there, but it's definitely a band that's aware of the noisier end of the rock spectrum that came up out of post-punk.
I've got another Sharrock album (Black Woman) which is pretty far out in its own way, but his tone there is relatively thin and spidery. here his sound is fuzzy and thick. add Brotzmann doing his wailing sax thing and this album really kicks up a storm.
it's definitely still rock music of a kind, though. in fact there are a fair amount of bluesy moments and even some riffs I could imagine Zeppelin spitting out on one of their looser nights.
the only down point for me is that Laswell's bass tone is an acquired taste. it's kinda squelchy. I think he might be aiming for a dubby sound but it just sounds a bit processed.

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by toomilk » Fri Dec 04, 2015 3:18 am

I've been listening to Monk's Dream from the Thelonious Monk Quartet. So many great tunes on it with Thelonious' signature style. Love ittttttt. :twisted:

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by shalloboi » Sun Dec 06, 2015 7:29 am

toomilk wrote:I've been listening to Monk's Dream from the Thelonious Monk Quartet. So many great tunes on it with Thelonious' signature style. Love ittttttt. :twisted:
I used to have that on vinyl a really long time ago- I think I found it at jackpot in Portland for $5 or something. I really liked putting that one on at home by myself. I ended up selling nearly all of my jazz vinyl during a really long unemployment stint- 'monk's dream' and 'the shape of jazz to come' by Ornette Coleman are the two I miss the most from that time. Why in the world did I sell those?!

I still have 'black woman' by Sonny Sharrock- that's some really beautiful skronk!

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Fri Dec 11, 2015 9:18 am

I've got Black Woman too... I like it, but I must admit the Yoko Ono style vocal wailings do turn me off a bit! superb guitar playing though.

in other news a set has recently been released of the complete A Love Supreme sessions. seems there weren't actually that many takes (which is impressive in itself) so it's not as huge as say some of the Miles Davis boxes.

http://www.uncut.co.uk/reviews/album/jo ... te-masters

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Sat Feb 27, 2016 4:07 pm

found a lot of great stuff on a norwegian label called Rune Grammofon. not only are they home to the excellent Supersilent, but also some other stuff that has the freedom of jazz but the power of rock- I'd recommend Krokofant, Hedvig Mollestad Trio, and Elephant9 - their latest album features Reine Fiske from Dungen on guitar and it's excellent.

http://www.runegrammofon.com/

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by ro » Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:42 am

thought this might be of interest:

http://weekertoft.com

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Fri Oct 07, 2016 9:38 pm

ro wrote:thought this might be of interest:

http://weekertoft.com
very nice! I like the look of these. some familiar names there- anything with Chris Corsano is worth listening to in my book.
matching sleeves in the series too.. I'm a sucker for that shit! gotta collect 'em all :)

glad others are contributing to this thread.. it was in danger of becoming a bit of an echo chamber! and I'm no jazz aficionado, I'm still a bit of a dilettante with it really.

one thing I checked out recently was 'Room' by Nels Cline and Julian Lage. from Nels other work you might expect his usual dips into noise and effects- but this is simply both guitarist (in seperate left and right stereo channels) playing very cleanly and with no effects. when i'm in the right mood, its great stuff.

here's some vid

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hzy97Bao4NE

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Fri Sep 27, 2019 4:08 pm

some news for the jazzers around these parts, also with a Spiritualized connection

new Evan Parker album, also features John Coxon and Ashley Wales so could be considered a Spring Heel Jack record of sorts.

had a little listen and sounds more ambient than anything.

https://intaktrec.bandcamp.com/album/cr ... kelsdorf-2


also as an aside, my journey into jazz has been a bit of a minefield to say the least. a lot of endless dirge out there. but I have to recommend one album in particular. Tony Williams drummed with Miles Davis but then went on to form his jazz fusion outfit Lifetime (with John McLaughlin on guitar, Larry Young on keyboards)

I checked out their first album Emergency! and it's just superb- just the kind of jazz I was looking for. noisy and intense at times but with the freedom of jazz
legend goes that the recording engineer wasn't used to capturing a group playing at rock band volume levels so much of it sounds distorted and fuzzy.

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by simonkeeping » Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:10 am

Here's a few records I've stumbled across in my jazz quest / odessey.

For Alto - Anthony Braxton
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_t0esySWy0

Ornette Coleman - Science Fiction (the title track is amazing)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWpYyEPIw0Y

Not really that 'dirty' but to my ears anything with Alice Coltrane on is incredible

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwQwXlQyha8

one of my favourite albums of all time:
Pharoah Sanders - The Creator Has A Master Plan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZ6lB7FKxi8
found via the legendary Primal Scream breezeblock mix and I subsequently found out the day the band were due to record with Pharaoh Sanders for XTMNR he (or one of his people) showed up at the studio and asked for a large amount of money in cash which they didn't have and so he didn't record with them. They then laid down Accelerator.

Sun Ra - Atlantis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5dIkFmafx4

Don cherry - Brown Rice
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WS8PK53DYGA

Miles - Big fun Electric Miles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFOLt9kSbTw

Miles - rated X Relentless electricity
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrjFtbGKqFk

By the way - Treader are re-releasing a lot of their albums on vinyl now. check out honest Jons for what's available.

https://honestjons.com
http://www.soundcloud.com/haarlemriots

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by endsprings » Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:06 am

angelsighs wrote:
Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:33 pm
ah Derek Bailey! I've tried a bit of him, very unique acoustic guitar playing! fractured, explosive, almost percussively hitting the guitar at points
what would be a good album to start with him?

one other guy I tried that I would put in the same category is Bill Orcutt. he does electric guitar too but I found his acoustic guitar playing to have a lot of similar qualities. there's an album called A History Of Everyone which is his reinterpretations of old standards. easy listening it is not!

Two of the very best. Big guitar heroes of mine. Bailey's playing and outlook on music was truly inspirational.
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by endsprings » Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:08 am

The Spring Heel Jack Live album featuring Mr Spaceman is phenomenal! Highly recommended.
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:40 pm

Thanks for the pointers simonkeeping, plenty to check out there. haha yes a journey into jazz can be seen as an odyssey of sorts. I must say it's been a bit of a minefield for me with plenty of dreck out there (particularly in terms of jazz fusion).



I think the Spring Heel Jack stuff definitely stands up even beyond the Spaceman connection.

On checking the Honest Jons site.. how did I not know there was a Low/SHJ collaboration??

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by endsprings » Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:15 pm

angelsighs wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:40 pm
Thanks for the pointers simonkeeping, plenty to check out there. haha yes a journey into jazz can be seen as an odyssey of sorts. I must say it's been a bit of a minefield for me with plenty of dreck out there (particularly in terms of jazz fusion).



I think the Spring Heel Jack stuff definitely stands up even beyond the Spaceman connection.

On checking the Honest Jons site.. how did I not know there was a Low/SHJ collaboration??

I agree man, SHJ are incredible on their own too.

If you like Derek Bailey you should check out Tashi Dorji, amazing guitarist.
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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by olan » Wed Oct 02, 2019 8:41 pm

I've been buying a fair amount of jazz over the last couple of years. I'm particularly keen on modern jazz coming out currently. I sure everyone is aware of Kamasi Washington, Sons of Kemet and Comet is Coming so I won't bother blathering on about them.

I can heartily recommend Idris Ackamoor who has a bunch of projects but Idris Ackamoor and the Pyramids (https://idrisackamoorandthepyramids.ban ... angel-fell new LP is worth a try. The other project of his that I've listened to a lot is Ill Considered (https://illconsidered.bandcamp.com/. I own all eight of the Ill Considered LPs and am waiting on some of the Pyramids LPs to turn up.

More in the vein of Comet is Coming (and featuring Shabaka Hutchings on their first LP) is Melt Yourself Down (https://www.meltyourselfdown.com/ ) or (https://meltyourselfdown.bandcamp.com/). Soccer96 is also worth checking out (https://soccer96.bandcamp.com/). Effectively this is Danalogue and Betamax from Comet is Coming in a more electronica take on Jazz.

Finally, a word for The Quiet Temple (Duke Garwood and Rich Machin) which features all sorts of interesting appearances from people involved with Soulsavers, Spiritualized, Stereolab and Julian Cope. Details are here if you've not heard it already (https://thequiettemple.bandcamp.com/alb ... iet-temple.

This is just a small selection. I use Bandcamp a lot, but also the Discover feature in Roon is a fantastic (and fantastically expensive) way to hear things that are related to music you alread own.

Sorry about the long waffling post, I didn't have time to write a short concise one :)

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Re: Outpatients Jazz Club

Post by angelsighs » Fri Oct 04, 2019 1:44 pm

thanks to you too Olan. looks like my weekend is going to be spent perusing lots of new jazz music!

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