Have to say...

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Laz69
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Have to say...

Post by Laz69 »

...after watching the Let It Come Down documentary again, i have a new appreciation of LICD after revisiting. And of the Spz version of Lord Can You Hear Me. I had forgotten just how amazing that live version was from the doc. And i was bloody there that night! :lol:

Still don't think its cohesive as an album and i don't think its flows well but, individually, there are some really great songs on there!

Gonna wrap my head around this for a few days.
angelsighs
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Re: Have to say...

Post by angelsighs »

I agree, I really like Let It Come Down and think it's really up there as one of the bands best albums. I can see why fans of the early stuff may be not as keen as it's quite a change in sound. But I just love that he really went for it with the orchestral epic style and didn't do it by halves. The production and sound quality is superb I reckon - there's so many instruments going on but everything sounds so clear and positively luminous. It's also the first of their albums where you can hear the drums properly.

LICD was the first of their albums I got into as it was released, rather than retrospectively. I also remember seeing that documentary on channel 4 and I still have my VHS of it here.

It's interesting, some of the songwriting chops are rock solid but there's also songs where the string and horn arrangements are absolutely integral to the songs. Unlike any number of indie bands who make a rather dull ballad on strummed guitars then add load of strings to try and force it to be epic or whatever.

I Didn't Mean To Hurt You is a good example - the string arrangement kind of *is* the song.

There are a couple of missteps - the rockers seem to suffer a bit, On Fire isn't that great and Twelve Steps is probably a better song but still sounds a bit suffocated. Won't Get To Heaven doesn't half go on as well...

Anyway I'll stop rambling now.. This album definitely deserves love though.
heisenberg
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Re: Have to say...

Post by heisenberg »

I love LICD. I remember when it came out and how I played every day for at least a year, blown away by how huge it sounded and how intricate the arrangements were. I like to think Jason knew how the music business was gonna go and decided that it was his best chance to make an album with a massive budget and just went for it. Respect to him for undertaking such a huge project. I think you perhaps do need to be in a certain mood to listen to this album. But then again it has songs on it like Do it All Over Again, I Didn't Mean To Hurt You and Stop Your Crying which immediately lift my mood.

Like angelsighs says, the arrangements are the songs. These don't sound like songs with bolted-on strings and brass, and for that reason I can't see it as being a bloated or over-produced record. Everything sounds crucial and you kind of have to give yourself over to the space it creates. But in a post 9/11 world when I wasn't at a great point myself, this record comforted me and proved a delicate and cathartic soundscape to get lost in. I love the instrumental breakdown in The Straight and The Narrow. Anything More is the most underrated ballad of the 21st century- what a classic. The acoustic mainlines version is arguably more direct and communicative to a general audience, but to this day I am still overwhelmed by the recording version's strings, the pre-verse drum fills and little hidden nugget that is the banjo. And despite much competition, I still think Don't Just do Something is my favourite Spiritualized track. Such a superb lyric- how could anyone not think it was written personally for them? That outro- with the guitars going wild, then a coda where the trademark one note keyboard drone and heavenly choir surrounding what is a moving but also self-deprecating vocal and lyric by Jason. Pure magic.

My main gripe would be that Going Down Slow didn't make the cut. Perhaps not an easy track to fit in among the final running order, but one I'd have loved to have seen on the album regardless. But then again, its 'lost track' status just adds to its legend.

I am very excited to see what the reissue program holds for Pure Phase and LICD. LAGWAFIS gets the majority of the attention, but the aforementioned duo of albums interest me more. Here's hoping for some outtakes/alternative versions. One can dream!
niamhm
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Re: Have to say...

Post by niamhm »

Wont Get To Heaven could go on twice as long for me tbh, probably my fav track on the album and contains one of my all time fav intros, sublime stuff
sunray
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Re: Have to say...

Post by sunray »

angelsighs wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:33 pm There are a couple of missteps - the rockers seem to suffer a bit, On Fire isn't that great and Twelve Steps is probably a better song but still sounds a bit suffocated. Won't Get To Heaven doesn't half go on as well...
:lol: Hilarious :lol: Twelve Steps and Won't Get To Heaven are the only two songs that thrill me on LICD!
I'm certainly in agreement with niamhm on the latter. The rest of the album is fine but i could take it or leave it really.
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angelsighs
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Re: Have to say...

Post by angelsighs »

sunray wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:25 pm :lol: Hilarious :lol: Twelve Steps and Won't Get To Heaven are the only two songs that thrill me on LICD!
I'm certainly in agreement with niamhm on the latter. The rest of the album is fine but i could take it or leave it really.
interesting! just to be clear, I don't think that Won't Get To Heaven is a bad song per se, I just think it goes on a bit long. it's also an instance of Jason falling into auto pilot mode in terms of lyrics. it's not a big deal but the rest of the album has some really great lyrics where you can tell he put a lot of work in.
I think The Twelve Steps would have been better served being produced more like Electricity or something like that. bit more static and noise.
heisenberg wrote: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:29 pm
I love the instrumental breakdown in The Straight and The Narrow. Anything More is the most underrated ballad of the 21st century- what a classic. The acoustic mainlines version is arguably more direct and communicative to a general audience, but to this day I am still overwhelmed by the recording version's strings, the pre-verse drum fills and little hidden nugget that is the banjo. And despite much competition, I still think Don't Just do Something is my favourite Spiritualized track. Such a superb lyric- how could anyone not think it was written personally for them?
agree with everything you've said here! Anything More is an gorgeous ballad- that banjo part... small but effective.
the middle eight in The Straight & The Narrow.. classic songwriting.. and that vibraphone!
and Don't Just Do Something is one of my all time Spiritualized songs. the lyrics are witty & moving, and the structure is brilliant, it's not just a campfire ballad it goes round and round then it builds up hugely until the end when it all washes away and Jason is left alone. superb.
Laz69
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Re: Have to say...

Post by Laz69 »

So after listening to this all day, i thought i'd summarise my thoughts upon giving this a good few listens. I'm shit at describing things, so please bare with me. Hard to explain things sometimes :lol: There was definitely a post-Ladies & Gents expectation from me at the time, and that definitely influenced my thoughts on this at the time, being one of those who harked after days-gone-by back then.

On Fire still doesn't sit right with me. Too much Jools Holland-style plinky plonky piano and the song just sounds weak to me. Twelve Steps, apart from sounding like a recycling of Electricity, suffers mostly for just not fitting in with the rest of the album for me. The strings sound out of place with the other areas of orchestration on the album (they remind me of something else but can't put my finger on it). And "police sirens"? Really??? :lol: Some nice lyrics tho. Stop Your Crying is a lovely song, but sounds like it was written specifically as a single for the charts and dropped randomly into the album. My wife loves it, so its probably hit the mark there! :lol:

Don't Just Do Something is real nice, but the change of tempo seems to loose its momentum for me. Yeah, it kicks in again and finishes the song off nicely, but i feel like i'm starting the song over again. If the song just continued with that initial part, over and over, building to a crescendo (in a Feels Like I'm Going Home way from PP), then this would have much more impact for me.

Out of Sight, I Didn't Mean To Hurt You, Anything More are all brilliant. Great songs and sound HUGE when it all kicks in. Great riffs and guitar touches, and the orchestration is just sublime.

The Straight And The Narrow i've always thought would have sounded better as a simple acoustic track. But the stings on this are really wonderful upon revisiting. Much better than i remember it.

Won't Get Into Heaven... is probably my favourite from the album. I love how the song gets the time to stretch its wings and there is no sense of needing to rush any of it. Suffers slightly from the "Jools" effect when the tempo changes (plinky plonk piano doesn't bring anything to it - bringing the bass more to the front would have been nice), but it doesn't take over. Rich, lush, warm, uplifting, visionary. Would have had this as the opener of the album, seguing beautifully into Do It All Over Again.

Lord, Can You Hear Me is a Spacemen 3 classic. The original is utterly perfect and I was always swayed by that, as i felt this version embellished the original slightly. Its probably just the huge different in approach in both versions. The original, in its stark simplistic "death-bed" beauty, and this reworking with its huge depth of sound and multitude of elements just felt poles apart, but i can actually appreciate this much much more now. The angelic choir, the wall of sound is just as powerful as the original. Defo shoud have been longer to really let it soar.

Its been fun going back to this again. Really enjoyed the listens and giving the songs some air time. Can't fault Jason for going all out putting this album together and making the most of everything available to him, just wish some of the songs were stronger, but i suppose thats just my expectations from someone whose music means so much to me.
sunray
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Re: Have to say...

Post by sunray »

Laz69 wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 11:20 am Twelve Steps, apart from sounding like a recycling of Electricity, suffers mostly for just not fitting in with the rest of the album for me. The strings sound out of place with the other areas of orchestration on the album (they remind me of something else but can't put my finger on it). And "police sirens"? Really??? :lol: Some nice lyrics tho.
Fucking hell, i'm soooo out of touch with what Spiritualized fans seem to like :lol: That break down with the strings and sirens is what makes the Twelve Steps (plus the lyrics). It's always conjured up images of some gritty 70s American cop show for me. Mean, dirty streets of New York or San Francisco populated by pimps, pushers and thieves.
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Laz69
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Re: Have to say...

Post by Laz69 »

sunray wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:10 pm
Laz69 wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 11:20 am Twelve Steps, apart from sounding like a recycling of Electricity, suffers mostly for just not fitting in with the rest of the album for me. The strings sound out of place with the other areas of orchestration on the album (they remind me of something else but can't put my finger on it). And "police sirens"? Really??? :lol: Some nice lyrics tho.
Fucking hell, i'm soooo out of touch with what Spiritualized fans seem to like :lol: That break down with the strings and sirens is what makes the Twelve Steps (plus the lyrics). It's always conjured up images of some gritty 70s American cop show for me. Mean, dirty streets of New York or San Francisco populated by pimps, pushers and thieves.
I think you're being a little harsh on yourself :lol: Just little old me's opinion. There has been umpteen discussions on these things in the past. I get where your coming from, but 70s cop shows and gritty New York backgrounds doesn't "feel" very Spiritualized to me, at least not this LICD era. Does that make sense? Just seems out of place, and its things like that that i struggle with on this LP. Just the cohesion of it all... it seems "disjointed".

(I do wish i could place the strings on Twelve Steps... sounds like something i've heard in another song but just can't recall which one!)
runcible
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Re: Have to say...

Post by runcible »

LICD certainly seemed to divide people on release. A lot of people expected Ladies & Gents part 2 which was always unlikely. The big budget and extensive musician list also caused suspicion. As someone who never liked LAGWAFIS - and my feelings haven't changed I'm afraid - I welcomed LICD quite favourably but it's grown on me more as the years go by. There are tunes I don't like much - step forward Stop Your Crying which, to me, sounds like a Spiritualized ballad 'by numbers'. But I think as an album it's aged very well and so it gets more play these days here than it did a decade ago.

It's amazing how Won't Get To Heaven is such a marmite tune. For me it's the best thing on the album and it could have carried on for a while after it stopped as far as I was concerned. But Jason always produced songs like that. Look at Lord Let It Rain On Me from Amazing Grace - equally loved and disliked by many on this forum (I'm in the thumbs up camp on that one!). One of the great things about Jason's music is it does pay off to revist areas you may have felt uncertain about initially.
Ian
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Re: Have to say...

Post by Ian »

Another thumbs up for Won't Get To Heaven. I remember reading a review that described it as the closing track, with Lord Can You Hear Me as a coda. Thinking of the album this way has helped me to appreciate the LICD version of LCYHM a bit more - as a bonus track, it's quite fun, but as the big album closer, its bombast is a bit too much to take, compared to the lovely sparse original.
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sunray
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Re: Have to say...

Post by sunray »

Laz69 wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:08 pm I think you're being a little harsh on yourself :lol: Just little old me's opinion. There has been umpteen discussions on these things in the past. I get where your coming from, but 70s cop shows and gritty New York backgrounds doesn't "feel" very Spiritualized to me, at least not this LICD era. Does that make sense? Just seems out of place, and its things like that that i struggle with on this LP.

(I do wish i could place the strings on Twelve Steps... sounds like something i've heard in another song but just can't recall which one!)
Ah right, yeah that makes sense, I guess Twelve Steps doesn't really fit with the rest of the album. I love it all the same! The strings might be an Isaac Hayes/Curtis Mayfield tune. Or maybe a Bobbie Gentry type song. There is a familiarity to them alright.
runcible wrote: Wed Apr 14, 2021 1:12 pm LICD certainly seemed to divide people on release. A lot of people expected Ladies & Gents part 2 which was always unlikely.
Funny, that's how i've always viewed it. It just took the elements of L&G that i was least enamoured with though and concentrated on those.
Ian wrote: Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:08 pm Lord Can You Hear Me...as the big album closer, its bombast is a bit too much to take, compared to the lovely sparse original.
Yeah, i still can't get on board with that version. When it kicks in i get annoyed :lol:
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angelsighs
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Re: Have to say...

Post by angelsighs »

Yeah I reckon the strings on The Twelve Steps are in the vein of something like Curtis Mayfield

Interesting to hear everyone's different views on the album here. In a few months it will be 20 years old..
ABOCA
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Re: Have to say...

Post by ABOCA »

Good to see LICD getting re-evaluated. It did always appear to be in unfairly compared to LAGWAFS, even though it was over four years later when it was finally released. I loved the album when it first came out, but this was one of the albums I revisited over deepest, darkest lockdown that blew me away all over again. There are some great word play lyrics across the whole album and I wish Jason had kept the original title of Stop Your Crying which was Nothing Hurts.

I love Anything More, and the way the intro is a continuation of the last part of the intro from Sam Cooke’s A Change Is Gonna Come.

Won’t Get To Heaven would be the one track I would select from the album, if I had to compile a personal compilation of Spiritualized tracks and was only allowed to use one track from each album. It’s an incredible piece of music.

I last listened to it on the Plain Recordings vinyl, which I think actually sounds really good. But, if the reissue program can improve on this, which I’m sure it will, I can’t wait for it to come out.
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