In response this post by $26: I suppose most of this bile is because of my continued refusal to recognize Radiohead as anything but a middling prog-pop group at their best and 'eclectic' carpetbaggers at their worst. I find them ridiculous. A lot of critics do. A lot of listeners do. A lot of very serious people, from their mid-teens to mid-twenties, mostly with thick black plastic bifocals, disagree and think they're not only the best pop group of the nineties, they're the best pop group ever, and what the hell is that asshole twentysixdollars calling the prophets of the new post-modern music a pop group. Asshole. He really is an asshole. And he pissed on his mommy too.
Here we go:
I find Radiohead to be a truly inspirational band. I could care less who finds them “ridiculous,†be it you, $26, some snotty rock journalists or anyone else. You can name almost any band that ever existed and accurately state that it had both loyal fans and fire-breathing critics. Obviously there are people who don’t like Radiohead … big deal. In my humble opinion, however, they’re one of the few current acts that consistently come up with fascinating music, not to mention the intricate artwork that accompanies it. Moreover, their live show is tremendous.
I could choose to hide under a blanket, be cool, and pretend that Supersilent or Mogwai are my favorite bands (and I DO like them) … it’d be a lot easier. Both seem to be much more acceptable in that they never get any radio play, are rarely on the cover of magazines and are more “challenging†to the listener. It just so happens that I enjoy Radiohead more. I can detail many reasons why I feel this way:
Jonny Greenwood is not only a great fucking guitar player, he’s an all around excellent musician. As far as I can tell, the only thing he can’t do is sing.
The Bends is chock full of excellent rock songs. It’s a straightforward record full of heart and soul. In fact, I hear a lot of soul in Radiohead’s songs. That’s definitely one of things that keeps me coming back to their records. I’m sure some will argue that it’s a put on, or that it seems cold and distant (perhaps on a few random tracks like “I Am Citizen Insane†really are a bit cold), but I don’t have a any trouble hearing real feeling in most of the material.
Their tendency to use of electronic and other unconventional instruments, as opposed to the standard guitar-drums-bass combination, in a highly skilled manner keeps their records sounding fresh and allows their sound to evolve. No, it’s not revolutionary to incorporate synths, drum-machines, computers, etc. into a rock setting, but it sure as hell makes for a more stimulating listen.
While Thom Yorke’s lyrics may get a bit preachy at times, he certainly has a knack for coming up with superb melodies (Karma Police, Fake Plastic Trees, Sail To The Moon).
OK Computer may not be, as Q and many other publications seem to believe, the best album of the 90’s, but it’s a damn fine piece of work. Sure, it’s a big proggy, but it also contains simple beauties like “Let Down†and “No Surprises.†The fact that I can easily listen to it all the way through, over and over without tiring of it bring me great joy.
Nigel Godrich is a fantastic engineer and producer. Radiohead’s records SOUND brilliant!
Along with Spiritualized and Super Furry Animals, their live show is one of very few that has been so good as to bring me close to tears. I’m not romanticizing … it’s just a fact.
I can see how one could get annoyed with Radiohead. They’ve enjoyed a huge amount of success and perhaps are a bit overrated, but to dismiss their work is to miss out on some excellent music … in my opinion, of course.
I could go on, but I’ve got other things to do. Enjoy!
Re: $26 vs. Radiohead
Moderators: sunny, BzaInSpace, runcible, spzretent
I'll get in quick here and say what I think.
$26 is one of the most infuriating and opiniated music fans I've come across. He has an opinion on everything. The trouble is a lot of his opinions (most of which I disagree with) are well thought out and have good evidence and knowledge backing them up. Where he falls down, in my opinion, is in his eagerness to shoot down a band someone likes. He pissed me off when he slagged off Clinic about 18 months ago after I raved about them. Personally if someone wants to praise a band then let them. I won't immediately reach for my keyboard to say 'that band is shite'. I consider any band I dislike fair game if I bring the subject up first, but I'll let others wank themselves silly over acts I don't appreciate without saying too much. OK I've been known to get excited about the Manics who I regard as the most offensive group that's ever existed but that's a different story. The end story to 26 is if he posts something I will read it; he's long-winded but always interesting. I think the fact that his and my opinions tend to run miles apart but in the same direction makes my fascination for what he writes here what it is.
Radiohead are something I have no problem with but who I don't particularly like or dislike. I actually love a few songs on OK Computer - Airbag is fantastic. Sure I don't think they are as incredible as you Mr Warmth, but that's OK. I gasped slightly when OK said they OK Computer was the best album ever, but people laugh when I say I think Perfect Prescription holds that spot. To many, someone kicking their favourite band in the balls is a sin. I'm waiting for the flak I'll get for insulting Prince in another thread (which will be nothing compared to how excited someone got at a record fair at my stall when they asked if I had any Michael Jackson and I said 'no' - they asked why and I said, to my regret, 'cos he's crap' - quite a scene ensued). Moving back... Radiohead are obviously decent musicians, write decent songs, and come across as decent guys. I won't buy their music but I'd rather they were huge than the Manics - maybe 26 thinks in a parallel way but I bet its just because of the fuss made over Radiohead. There are plenty worse acts out there - hell, check out the charts!
I learnt to dodge 26's chunks of wind-up material a few months after joining this borad and now I read his posts with interest, often hoping he'll show his pompous side as it creates fun. I've said it time and time again - anyone who bothers to post stuff here with passion and regularity HAS to have a pompous and opinitated side. If those characteristics were removed this place would be very dull.
$26 is one of the most infuriating and opiniated music fans I've come across. He has an opinion on everything. The trouble is a lot of his opinions (most of which I disagree with) are well thought out and have good evidence and knowledge backing them up. Where he falls down, in my opinion, is in his eagerness to shoot down a band someone likes. He pissed me off when he slagged off Clinic about 18 months ago after I raved about them. Personally if someone wants to praise a band then let them. I won't immediately reach for my keyboard to say 'that band is shite'. I consider any band I dislike fair game if I bring the subject up first, but I'll let others wank themselves silly over acts I don't appreciate without saying too much. OK I've been known to get excited about the Manics who I regard as the most offensive group that's ever existed but that's a different story. The end story to 26 is if he posts something I will read it; he's long-winded but always interesting. I think the fact that his and my opinions tend to run miles apart but in the same direction makes my fascination for what he writes here what it is.
Radiohead are something I have no problem with but who I don't particularly like or dislike. I actually love a few songs on OK Computer - Airbag is fantastic. Sure I don't think they are as incredible as you Mr Warmth, but that's OK. I gasped slightly when OK said they OK Computer was the best album ever, but people laugh when I say I think Perfect Prescription holds that spot. To many, someone kicking their favourite band in the balls is a sin. I'm waiting for the flak I'll get for insulting Prince in another thread (which will be nothing compared to how excited someone got at a record fair at my stall when they asked if I had any Michael Jackson and I said 'no' - they asked why and I said, to my regret, 'cos he's crap' - quite a scene ensued). Moving back... Radiohead are obviously decent musicians, write decent songs, and come across as decent guys. I won't buy their music but I'd rather they were huge than the Manics - maybe 26 thinks in a parallel way but I bet its just because of the fuss made over Radiohead. There are plenty worse acts out there - hell, check out the charts!
I learnt to dodge 26's chunks of wind-up material a few months after joining this borad and now I read his posts with interest, often hoping he'll show his pompous side as it creates fun. I've said it time and time again - anyone who bothers to post stuff here with passion and regularity HAS to have a pompous and opinitated side. If those characteristics were removed this place would be very dull.
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Re: $26 vs. Radiohead
But you see, Warmth, you've gone and enumerated many of the things that I find most irritating about the group and their fans. I'll quote them so we know what we're playing with:
1. That artwork, very much derived from Wish You Were Here. Would Donwood have attained any degree of prominence without the sucess of his artschool chums?
3. What Radiohead has is great bread-and-butter songwriting.
4. But he's so sincere and cute.
Tomorrow I'll get to what I dislike about Godrich's productions of late but this should do for now.
What we have is not an argument in which I disagree with your contentions, but rather one in which I use your own contentious to defend my position, and vice versa. It seems that precisely what I find most stomach-churning about Radiohead is what the fans find so life-changing.
1. That artwork, very much derived from Wish You Were Here. Would Donwood have attained any degree of prominence without the sucess of his artschool chums?
2. Sounds appropriated from electropop in a guitar-rock format misinterpreted as strong musicianshipTheWarmth wrote: they’re one of the few current acts that consistently come up with fascinating music, not to mention the intricate artwork that accompanies it.
Disagree. Greenwood makes some interesting noises, but as a soloist he's merely average (Ron Asheton, a player I don't exactly respect, is more unhinged but also has more interesting note choices, and he's no slower.) Greenwood's reputation largely stems from the fact that the elaborate, effects-laden solo was so out-of-fashion when the band hit it big in 1995. Noel Gallagher's solos went on forever, sure, but they were so "Let It Be" in orientation that they didn't hit with the same 'pomo' thump. In other words, Johnny Greenwood is considered a great, or innovative, guitarist only to those who haven't listened intently to Robert Fripp, who was doing the same sort of thing decades previous. HIs other instrumental work I won't comment on, because playing an Ondes is a lot less difficult than finding one, and his affection for analogue synths is no more attractive than Peter Kember's.Jonny Greenwood is not only a great fucking guitar player, he’s an all around excellent musician. As far as I can tell, the only thing he can’t do is sing.
3. What Radiohead has is great bread-and-butter songwriting.
On the contrary on both points. The Bends is full of Smiths/U2esque filler ("Black Star", "Bones", "My Iron Lung") and many of the louder numbers are interchangeable. "Sulk" is like any number of tunes on the first album, a lot of the songs sound merely tired, and the one great "Money"-style prog tune ("Just") is the one that everybody cites barring the others. I confess that Fake Plastic Trees sounds heartfelt, but it's the sort of hackneyed post-grunge sentiment that just isn't unique. It's there in Soundgarden. The Bends has the reputation it does because Radiohead got really ambitious shortly thereafter. For its time it's actually a bit on the formulaic side.The Bends is chock full of excellent rock songs. It’s a straightforward record full of heart and soul.
4. But he's so sincere and cute.
I guess our definitions of soul are different. Most o Yorke's lyrics are cryptic narcissism, outwardly contemptuous, or simply leftist screeds, and I'm not moved by any of it.In fact, I hear a lot of soul in Radiohead’s songs. That’s definitely one of things that keeps me coming back to their records. I’m sure some will argue that it’s a put on, or that it seems cold and distant (perhaps on a few random tracks like “I Am Citizen Insane†really are a bit cold), but I don’t have a any trouble hearing real feeling in most of the material.
Tomorrow I'll get to what I dislike about Godrich's productions of late but this should do for now.
What we have is not an argument in which I disagree with your contentions, but rather one in which I use your own contentious to defend my position, and vice versa. It seems that precisely what I find most stomach-churning about Radiohead is what the fans find so life-changing.
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
As always I am humbled by my learned companion. Runcie's spot on about our relationship here: I don't think we've ever agreed (about anything significant) unless it was something we both disliked. But I respect and admire his posts and research above all others.runcible wrote: $26 is one of the most infuriating and opiniated music fans I've come across. He has an opinion on everything. The trouble is a lot of his opinions (most of which I disagree with) are well thought out and have good evidence and knowledge backing them up.
But I acknowledge that if there's a word to describe me it's 'infuriating', particularly if I've just trampled on something you really hold dear. Actually I find people are most offended when I damn something with faint praise: "S'OK" has gotten me into a lot more trouble than "It's shit".
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
-
BzaInSpace
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3864
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: HELL
Please, while that's funny, I wrote alot more than just that. Anyways, I reviewed their records, unlike others. Am I wrong?twentysixdollars wrote:Ugh.
I can't believe I read the whole thing.Clownbait wrote: The first song is good. The second song is OK. The third song is terrific. The fourth song is good. The fifth song is OK. The sixth song is what it is.
The artwork is cool. Better than OK. Less than terrfic. Not exactly excellent.
Last edited by Clownbait on Mon Jul 26, 2004 2:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
-
BzaInSpace
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3864
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: HELL
I read somewhere (here?) a detractor's statement calling them "U2 for the iPod generation"*. Sounds about right. Overhyped, self-important, self-indulgent, and we will all have to suffer through their uninspired crap for many years to come.
* Yes, it was here. Good quote Bza.
* Yes, it was here. Good quote Bza.
Last edited by runaway on Mon Jul 26, 2004 3:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
Why would you? do you watch that much MTV? do you spend that much time listening to the newest modern rock station? If you dont like something turn it off. There are tons of bands I dont like with hit singles and I never have to listen to them. You will only suffer as long as you live an uninspired crap of a life with no ability to control what you listen to.runaway wrote:I read somewhere (here?) a detractor's statement calling them "U2 for the iPod generation". Sounds about right. Overhyped, self-important, self-indulgent and we will all have to suffer through their uninspired crap for many years to come.
Clownbait wrote:Why would you? do you watch that much MTV? do you spend that much time listening to the newest modern rock station? If you dont like something turn it off. There are tons of bands I dont like with hit singles and I never have to listen to them. You will only suffer as long as you live an uninspired crap of a life with no ability to control what you listen to.
Well, do you suggest I get up off my ass and leave the room when they play the inevitable halftime show during the Superbowl in a couple year's time?
That's asking too much!
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
here's another bit of my opinion you all can have a field day with.
I like U2, alot. I think they are the Stones of their generation. Same four guys for the whole ride all the way up until now. i dont like their whole catalog. i hate War, Zooropa and Pop. But the whole rest of the catalog stands up to anything any of the post punk bands have done and for much longer period of time.
And i thought their halftime show at the Superbowl was perfect. In good taste after 9/11. I still get goosebumps thinking about it.
The only similarity I see is the self rightousness of both and thank god U2 have nipped it in the bud.
I would go see U2 anytime if I had a ticket. I wouldn't walk across the street to see Radiohead. I'm just not interested. I'm sure they would play all their newer material which I have no time for at all.
I like U2, alot. I think they are the Stones of their generation. Same four guys for the whole ride all the way up until now. i dont like their whole catalog. i hate War, Zooropa and Pop. But the whole rest of the catalog stands up to anything any of the post punk bands have done and for much longer period of time.
And i thought their halftime show at the Superbowl was perfect. In good taste after 9/11. I still get goosebumps thinking about it.
The only similarity I see is the self rightousness of both and thank god U2 have nipped it in the bud.
I would go see U2 anytime if I had a ticket. I wouldn't walk across the street to see Radiohead. I'm just not interested. I'm sure they would play all their newer material which I have no time for at all.
They do play quite a bit of their new stuff at their latest shows. You can view the setlists here.spzretent wrote:I would go see U2 anytime if I had a ticket. I wouldn't walk across the street to see Radiohead. I'm just not interested. I'm sure they would play all their newer material which I have no time for at all.
http://www.ateaseweb.com/live/2003/index.php
I had a chance to go see em this past year and go to an after party and meet the band. Only thing is I would have had to have gone with a crazy woman who was merely intersted in forcing herself into every aspect of my life that she could. So I went to the bar and got drunk, and I dont regret it for a second.
[quote="Clownbait"]
They do play quite a bit of their new stuff at their latest shows. You can view the setlists here.
http://www.ateaseweb.com/live/2003/index.php
quote]
To be honest, I wouldn't know it anyway. Dont need the setlists. That would just confuse me more.
Are they like the Grateful Dead for the iPod generation?
They do play quite a bit of their new stuff at their latest shows. You can view the setlists here.
http://www.ateaseweb.com/live/2003/index.php
quote]
To be honest, I wouldn't know it anyway. Dont need the setlists. That would just confuse me more.
Are they like the Grateful Dead for the iPod generation?
Happiness is just a click awayspzretent wrote:Are they like the Grateful Dead for the iPod generation?
http://koti.mbnet.fi/dukeirot/ep3/dvd-t ... tensen.avi
well well well...
all this rant on radiohead?
well, guess i'll throw some two cents in...
i think radiohead is "weird" music for straight people..."straight" as in drugless folk
all the kids i know like radiohead cuz it's "different" music for them that is "safe"...they're all sober.
kids that have a deep spot in their heart dig spiritualized and spaceman 3, not cuz it's fashionable, but because they can relate...most likely heavy into drugs currently or at one point in their lives.
radio head is "cover of the magazine" type.
paz.
well, guess i'll throw some two cents in...
i think radiohead is "weird" music for straight people..."straight" as in drugless folk
all the kids i know like radiohead cuz it's "different" music for them that is "safe"...they're all sober.
kids that have a deep spot in their heart dig spiritualized and spaceman 3, not cuz it's fashionable, but because they can relate...most likely heavy into drugs currently or at one point in their lives.
radio head is "cover of the magazine" type.
paz.
still falling
-
BzaInSpace
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3864
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: HELL
For all the people who dig radiohead, go and hunt down a Live album by Charles Mingus - 'The Complete Town Hall Concert 1962'.
Let me know what you think of 'Freedom' (part 1 + 2).... that weird off time clap seem a little familiar ?
'Pyramid Song', I thought that was great.
u2 I never managed to get, but the Batman 2 theme was top... probably cause it dodn't sound like them!
Let me know what you think of 'Freedom' (part 1 + 2).... that weird off time clap seem a little familiar ?
'Pyramid Song', I thought that was great.
u2 I never managed to get, but the Batman 2 theme was top... probably cause it dodn't sound like them!
Bza, you really do dig deeply!BzaInSpace wrote:For all the people who dig radiohead, go and hunt down a Live album by Charles Mingus - 'The Complete Town Hall Concert 1962'.
i mean i can't be very wrong that you have searched out everyfuckingthing that Jason Pierce has ever mentioned and recommended. i can't do that, there simply ain't possibilities.so, i read in a interview that SPZ had in backroom (in Vienna??) wine, cheese and Mingus CD's lying all over the place. mingus mingus mingus.
but then again, of course, everybody can just stumble on whatever. on a goldmine. keep on digging!
(i like to dislike radiohead)
-
The Sprawl
- Known user
- Posts: 51
- Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 7:43 pm
Re: $26 vs. Radiohead
[quote="twentysixdollars"]But you see, Warmth, you've gone and enumerated many of the things that I find most irritating about the group and their fans.
I apologise for deleting the rest of this guy's solipsistic twitterings. I come in once in a while to have a look at this messageboard, just to see what's going on and to read the often funny and interesting opinions of the people in here. However, everytime I come in here the posts are dominated by this 26 dollars guy's tyrranical musical snobbery.
I've never read more pompous, predictable opinions in my life. They're (unintentionally) sometimes quite funny, and I'd never mention how sometimes I find myself laughing at the factual mistakes he makes cos that'd be mean, but it's all offset by the way he feels the need to demean people with different opinions to himself. Sure he'd say he never does, but when he sneers at someone who's just defending their favourite band he just comes off as a playground bully style critic. If he gets off on intimidating newcomers to this messageboard with a few token references to John Cage or Miles Davis(as I've seen 26 do before) and trying to impress people with his entry level knowledge of avant garde classical music then that's a tiny bit sad. Someone on this topic was saying how his opinions are always interesting and guaranteed to provoke debate - I think they gave him too much credit. I'm not writing in because his every opinion is inescapably stimulating, nor am I writing because I'm crazy about Radiohead and feel the need to spring to their defence every time anyone says Thom Yorke's a bit of a knob - I'm writing cos I don't like that kind of condescending yet slightly embarassingly ill-informed bully-cum-critic. This place is meant to welcome newcomers, not saddle them with a patronising David Brent clone the second they say they like a certain band.
I have absolutely no beef with anyone on this messageboard, by the way, and find it to be, in general the most well-informed, interesting and downright funny messageboard I've ever been on. And in reality I probably have no beef with this 26 quid guy- in fact I'm having a fancy dress part soon and I cordially invite him to turn up. I think he (it could be a she, although I sincerely doubt it)would look cute in a pirate costume. Come on 26, get that parrot on your shoulder.
[/i]
I apologise for deleting the rest of this guy's solipsistic twitterings. I come in once in a while to have a look at this messageboard, just to see what's going on and to read the often funny and interesting opinions of the people in here. However, everytime I come in here the posts are dominated by this 26 dollars guy's tyrranical musical snobbery.
I've never read more pompous, predictable opinions in my life. They're (unintentionally) sometimes quite funny, and I'd never mention how sometimes I find myself laughing at the factual mistakes he makes cos that'd be mean, but it's all offset by the way he feels the need to demean people with different opinions to himself. Sure he'd say he never does, but when he sneers at someone who's just defending their favourite band he just comes off as a playground bully style critic. If he gets off on intimidating newcomers to this messageboard with a few token references to John Cage or Miles Davis(as I've seen 26 do before) and trying to impress people with his entry level knowledge of avant garde classical music then that's a tiny bit sad. Someone on this topic was saying how his opinions are always interesting and guaranteed to provoke debate - I think they gave him too much credit. I'm not writing in because his every opinion is inescapably stimulating, nor am I writing because I'm crazy about Radiohead and feel the need to spring to their defence every time anyone says Thom Yorke's a bit of a knob - I'm writing cos I don't like that kind of condescending yet slightly embarassingly ill-informed bully-cum-critic. This place is meant to welcome newcomers, not saddle them with a patronising David Brent clone the second they say they like a certain band.
I have absolutely no beef with anyone on this messageboard, by the way, and find it to be, in general the most well-informed, interesting and downright funny messageboard I've ever been on. And in reality I probably have no beef with this 26 quid guy- in fact I'm having a fancy dress part soon and I cordially invite him to turn up. I think he (it could be a she, although I sincerely doubt it)would look cute in a pirate costume. Come on 26, get that parrot on your shoulder.
[/i]
-
a beautiful noise
- Known user
- Posts: 1783
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: things are easier said than done
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Why is it that when I'm criticizing someone, it's because they're wrong, (and I provice facts, 'entry-level' or not, to support my position), but when someone's criticizing me, it's because of my 'attitude'?
All you've proven is that you don't know what 'solipsistic' means. It's an indie-kid catchword, I'll give you that, so you're definitely conforming to the stereotype A-OK, but since when does the word have negative connotations? Ever heard of Descartes?
I don't care if I'm disliked. I would like, for once, someone to write a post of 2,000 words consisting of nothing but fact-supported criticism of my assertions. Anyone? I'm still waiting for someone to actually take one of my points and criticize it on a strictly factual basis. You, for example, Sprawl. Give it a shot. Your entire post was just pedantry to the same degree that I'm often accused of. And at least I'm unpretentious enough to end sentences with prepositions.
All you've proven is that you don't know what 'solipsistic' means. It's an indie-kid catchword, I'll give you that, so you're definitely conforming to the stereotype A-OK, but since when does the word have negative connotations? Ever heard of Descartes?
I don't care if I'm disliked. I would like, for once, someone to write a post of 2,000 words consisting of nothing but fact-supported criticism of my assertions. Anyone? I'm still waiting for someone to actually take one of my points and criticize it on a strictly factual basis. You, for example, Sprawl. Give it a shot. Your entire post was just pedantry to the same degree that I'm often accused of. And at least I'm unpretentious enough to end sentences with prepositions.
-
a beautiful noise
- Known user
- Posts: 1783
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: things are easier said than done
-
Spirit Ditch
- New user
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 6:09 pm
- Location: Arkansas, Scotland
Buddy, don't you see how inherently arrogant and pretentious your last quote was? Pretentiousness is great as long as there's something to back it up. You're a sixth form music critic, and any number of bitchy-housewife comebacks won't disguise this.twentysixdollars wrote:Why is it that when I'm criticizing someone, it's because they're wrong, (and I provice facts, 'entry-level' or not, to support my position), but when someone's criticizing me, it's because of my 'attitude'?
All you've proven is that you don't know what 'solipsistic' means. It's an indie-kid catchword, I'll give you that, so you're definitely conforming to the stereotype A-OK, but since when does the word have negative connotations? Ever heard of Descartes?
I don't care if I'm disliked. I would like, for once, someone to write a post of 2,000 words consisting of nothing but fact-supported criticism of my assertions. Anyone? I'm still waiting for someone to actually take one of my points and criticize it on a strictly factual basis. You, for example, Sprawl. Give it a shot. Your entire post was just pedantry to the same degree that I'm often accused of. And at least I'm unpretentious enough to end sentences with prepositions.
Your arrogance is wonderfully underlined when you assume I'd take time out to write 2000 words simply about you - you might think you're deserving of such unswerving attention but if you stepped back for a second you'd realise otherwise. I said what I felt because this is meant to be a messageboard for Spiritualized fans and I think when someone takes the time to come here, even if they do like Radiohead, then we as Spiritualized fans should be pleased that someone else likes the music we like.
As for conforming to a stereotype, you seem to be doing that pretty well yourself- your opinions are those of any number of fatuous wannabe critics, only unburdened by any of the wit, real knowledge or actual love for music that seems to come with being in the profession. I'm not going to get into a semantic slanging match with you but I do consider solipsistic opinions to be a negative, only I'd never highlight the word, because I'm not that insecure. Nor am I so insecure as to leave a preposterously self-conscious reference to Descartes in my post.
My comments were meant to be constructive- when you criticise people it's quite often because their tastes don't conform to yours(which are about as predictable as they come), not because, as you put it, they are wrong. If I like a band, I really want other people to hear them. I don't sneer in their face and flounce off, leaving a dustcloud of indie elitism in my path.
I continue to have no beef with anyone on this messageboard, and still think it's a top messageboard for a fabulous band, just don't like exclusionism.
And, although I'm moving house in a few days and am not sure when I'll next get to see this messageboard, the invitation to the costume party stands 26. There'll be jelly and icecream, and Radiohead said they'll be playing. Bye!
[/i]
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
So you've no time to actually critique anything I've said, but you've got enough to rag on me for several thousand words (under two different usernames!) for responding to a thread about that is actually about my dislike for Radiohead?
Whatever, dude. My reference to Descartes is apparently only 'preposterous' because you don't know why I invoked him. Solipsism is not a dirty word: 'fuck' is, or for that matter some snivelling misogynistic aside like 'bitchy housewife'.
Sixth former or not, I got paid - handsomely, for years - to do this.
Whatever, dude. My reference to Descartes is apparently only 'preposterous' because you don't know why I invoked him. Solipsism is not a dirty word: 'fuck' is, or for that matter some snivelling misogynistic aside like 'bitchy housewife'.
Sixth former or not, I got paid - handsomely, for years - to do this.
-
Spirit Ditch
- New user
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 6:09 pm
- Location: Arkansas, Scotland
All I have on the idea that you were a critic is your word for it and unless there's some evidence, I maintain that you're not a very good one. Your comments are stilted and the only time you seem to enjoy what you're doing is when you're tearing into someone. I've read thousands of critics and almost all of them have imbued what they write with at least a little bit of affection for the subject and, failing that, some wit. Quite simply, I don't believe you.
I maintain that your references are entry-level and self conscious, and if you're going to give me no reason to say otherwise then why would I say anything else? You don't seem to defend yourself with anything legitimate, rather you quote someone else. By the way - Descartes? Yes I do know why you invoked him, it's just a glaringly obvious reference- even my 14 year old sister know's who he is, so it really isn't impressive.
That aside, the one obvious omission from your startlingly bitter reply(paid handsomely- why'd you feel the need to throw that in?) was any actual reference to what I'm talking about - the exclusionism that you perpetuate. I didn't think you'd be able to deal with it properly so I wasn't expecting anything but one of your usual fob-offs, but you managed to tear into me like a wet paper bag without giving a flying one about this pretty important matter.
There are so many people who like music but haven't heard Spiritualized. I know that when I do a mixtape for someone I stuff it with Spiritualized or Spacemen 3, spend hours agonising over whether they'll like it and find it heartbreaking when they return it with a modest shrug and a "s'alright". When someone bothers to come here, because (I hope) they're interested in the band, I'd encourage them, not do what 26 dollars does. I don't care if this sounds mawkish or whatever but I like it when someone enjoys Spiritualized.
If you're going to completely ignore this criticism and fill your reply with tiresome references to Kierkegaard or something then don't bother posting one. I'm not interested in your insecurities, but I think you could improve this messageboard without trying very hard at all. The number of new people coming in would increase and wouldn't that be a good thing?
Although I'm a practically homeless student I genuinely do have things to do and I hear the delivery van pulling up outside. I realise I'm never going to have the finalword in this matter, so I just maintain, one final time, I have no beef with anyone else on this messageboard. I hope next time I'm in here, it's as cool as it always was, and I hope that Spiritualized write something that tops Ladies and Gentlemen at some point in the not too distant future. I also hope Manchester United(sorry everyone else) win the league this season. Bye for a while!
I maintain that your references are entry-level and self conscious, and if you're going to give me no reason to say otherwise then why would I say anything else? You don't seem to defend yourself with anything legitimate, rather you quote someone else. By the way - Descartes? Yes I do know why you invoked him, it's just a glaringly obvious reference- even my 14 year old sister know's who he is, so it really isn't impressive.
That aside, the one obvious omission from your startlingly bitter reply(paid handsomely- why'd you feel the need to throw that in?) was any actual reference to what I'm talking about - the exclusionism that you perpetuate. I didn't think you'd be able to deal with it properly so I wasn't expecting anything but one of your usual fob-offs, but you managed to tear into me like a wet paper bag without giving a flying one about this pretty important matter.
There are so many people who like music but haven't heard Spiritualized. I know that when I do a mixtape for someone I stuff it with Spiritualized or Spacemen 3, spend hours agonising over whether they'll like it and find it heartbreaking when they return it with a modest shrug and a "s'alright". When someone bothers to come here, because (I hope) they're interested in the band, I'd encourage them, not do what 26 dollars does. I don't care if this sounds mawkish or whatever but I like it when someone enjoys Spiritualized.
If you're going to completely ignore this criticism and fill your reply with tiresome references to Kierkegaard or something then don't bother posting one. I'm not interested in your insecurities, but I think you could improve this messageboard without trying very hard at all. The number of new people coming in would increase and wouldn't that be a good thing?
Although I'm a practically homeless student I genuinely do have things to do and I hear the delivery van pulling up outside. I realise I'm never going to have the finalword in this matter, so I just maintain, one final time, I have no beef with anyone else on this messageboard. I hope next time I'm in here, it's as cool as it always was, and I hope that Spiritualized write something that tops Ladies and Gentlemen at some point in the not too distant future. I also hope Manchester United(sorry everyone else) win the league this season. Bye for a while!
You blew it in the last bit about Man U. I respected your opinions til you said that.
The irritating thing about 26 is his eagerness to put a band down when someone else says they're cool. When I read someone's post saying how great someone else is and I don't agree I generally ignore it - 26 can't resist taking a pop. Someone said everyone should attend the Primals/Spiritualized fund raiser and no one had an excuse not to. I could have said that a) I have several children to look after and travelling 200 miles is kind of inconvenient, and b) Primal Scream are the worst live band I have ever seen and I absolutely despise them, but (although I have now come out with it) I didn't. I don't much like Radiohead either but simply slagging them off doesn't really assist the thread in developing - I just ignore it. But if someone praises a band I like I'll join in, as does 26, but as his taste is so entrenched in what he considers classic and influential music, the notion of something off the wall (like Sun O))) appealing to him is absurd. I'm very surprised he hasn't waded in and rubbished them yet!
But as far as his knowledge and listening experience goes I have mucho respect - he's provided me with a great deal of useful info and facts about music even though our tastes rarely coincide. And as for being pompous and opiniated, well, I've said it before, but everyone here is guilty of that. There can't be a single poster to any message board anywhere who isn't or they wouldn't have bothered posting anything.
The irritating thing about 26 is his eagerness to put a band down when someone else says they're cool. When I read someone's post saying how great someone else is and I don't agree I generally ignore it - 26 can't resist taking a pop. Someone said everyone should attend the Primals/Spiritualized fund raiser and no one had an excuse not to. I could have said that a) I have several children to look after and travelling 200 miles is kind of inconvenient, and b) Primal Scream are the worst live band I have ever seen and I absolutely despise them, but (although I have now come out with it) I didn't. I don't much like Radiohead either but simply slagging them off doesn't really assist the thread in developing - I just ignore it. But if someone praises a band I like I'll join in, as does 26, but as his taste is so entrenched in what he considers classic and influential music, the notion of something off the wall (like Sun O))) appealing to him is absurd. I'm very surprised he hasn't waded in and rubbished them yet!
But as far as his knowledge and listening experience goes I have mucho respect - he's provided me with a great deal of useful info and facts about music even though our tastes rarely coincide. And as for being pompous and opiniated, well, I've said it before, but everyone here is guilty of that. There can't be a single poster to any message board anywhere who isn't or they wouldn't have bothered posting anything.
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Well I guess we've whittled down his argument. Sounds primarily like Sprawl/Spirit Ditch is one of those trolling lurkers that is trying above all else to uncover who I am. Nice work with the textbook psychology, but hey, I was an undergrad once too. I haven't slipped up when people ask me nicely and I ain't going to do it now. Here's to your impeccable spelling and grammar, though.
For my part I'm going to duck out of this exchange early and respond to a very interesting email from Runcible.
For my part I'm going to duck out of this exchange early and respond to a very interesting email from Runcible.
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
-
SpacemanRob
- Known user
- Posts: 250
- Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 8:33 pm
$26, so smug, so arrogant, so obviously bereft of talent, so shallow, so see-through, so small-minded, so conservative, so middle-class, so egotistical, so Conservative, so ugly(mind & soul) and ultimately so dull....
If there was ever a thread where somebody's high opinion of themself dissolved through their own delusions this is it....
Shame that for such a good board we give a voice to a deluded fool...
'Critic', 'I got paid handsomely for years', 'uncover who i am(!!!!), 'bands who names i can pronounce'....
Your diatribes are dull, your elitism is dull, many of your tastes are dull and your rampant ego is dull....
Shame....
If there was ever a thread where somebody's high opinion of themself dissolved through their own delusions this is it....
Shame that for such a good board we give a voice to a deluded fool...
'Critic', 'I got paid handsomely for years', 'uncover who i am(!!!!), 'bands who names i can pronounce'....
Your diatribes are dull, your elitism is dull, many of your tastes are dull and your rampant ego is dull....
Shame....
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Ladies and gentlemen, Dorothy Parker!SpacemanRob wrote:$26, so smug, so arrogant, so obviously bereft of talent, so shallow, so see-through, so small-minded, so conservative, so middle-class, so egotistical, so Conservative, so ugly(mind & soul) and ultimately so dull....
If there was ever a thread where somebody's high opinion of themself dissolved through their own delusions this is it....
Shame that for such a good board we give a voice to a deluded fool...
'Critic', 'I got paid handsomely for years', 'uncover who i am(!!!!), 'bands who names i can pronounce'....
Your diatribes are dull, your elitism is dull, many of your tastes are dull and your rampant ego is dull....
Shame....
The words 'stimulating' and 'debate' are used together for a very good reason. Personally I think $26's general tastes are not what I'd listen to and I find many of the opinions expressed pretty loopy. But they get a response from a great many posters here (myself included), and more stimulating response than the posts which simply praise Jason. Remember the death threats from certain factions during the Gulf War? The idiotic anti-American rants? People who would attack an American poster because of their nationality? Mostly written by bandwagon jumping right-on types who had to be seen to be against anyone who was linked to America and Israel (which must have been very offensive to those who are linked to both). And that's just one big subject that caused uproar and fury here (although probably the most severe). It wasn't stimulating as people simply became blinkered by their hostility and wrote drivel for the most part.
I think the presence of a well-informed, highly irritating, deeply opiniated, self-satisfied but ultimately entertaining ex hack is a good thing, as is the response of so many to his stance. If you read my initial replies to the first posts of $26 a few years ago I got highly riled by what he was saying and responded so. Now I spot it straight away when the master of hornets-nest-poking is at work.
What's happening now is people are starting to copy $26's rather grandeur style of writing to make him look small. I really enjoy it when he gets a pasting - its normally very amusing to read and he always responds with such a care-free air. I wouldn't be able to take the personal attacks as he does without feeling offended, but the guy was a music critic so he'll be used to negative responses to his words. Poking holes in his opinion by calling him smug or arrogant isn't going to prove him so. Pointing out when he talks utter bollocks, as in his comments about reggae and Lee Perry, seems a better method of showing up the grey areas in his facts and figures.
I think the presence of a well-informed, highly irritating, deeply opiniated, self-satisfied but ultimately entertaining ex hack is a good thing, as is the response of so many to his stance. If you read my initial replies to the first posts of $26 a few years ago I got highly riled by what he was saying and responded so. Now I spot it straight away when the master of hornets-nest-poking is at work.
What's happening now is people are starting to copy $26's rather grandeur style of writing to make him look small. I really enjoy it when he gets a pasting - its normally very amusing to read and he always responds with such a care-free air. I wouldn't be able to take the personal attacks as he does without feeling offended, but the guy was a music critic so he'll be used to negative responses to his words. Poking holes in his opinion by calling him smug or arrogant isn't going to prove him so. Pointing out when he talks utter bollocks, as in his comments about reggae and Lee Perry, seems a better method of showing up the grey areas in his facts and figures.
$26 is just like our favorite band spiritualized. He's not immediately endearing but give him a chance and you might just find yourself enjoying his diatribes.
Don't take his put downs of other bands personally and everyone will go home happy. You can take mine personally though, radiohead blows. someone said it best already, weird music for straight people. And THOM is a true, shining examle of an annoying ass, makes our $26 look like gold every time he opens his mouth or his one good eyelid.
Descartes was related to Socrates right?
Don't take his put downs of other bands personally and everyone will go home happy. You can take mine personally though, radiohead blows. someone said it best already, weird music for straight people. And THOM is a true, shining examle of an annoying ass, makes our $26 look like gold every time he opens his mouth or his one good eyelid.
Descartes was related to Socrates right?
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Descartes is what you get in when descourses gets rainy.SpaceLine wrote:
Descartes was related to Socrates right?
Whereas Socrates play against the Socreskins. (Baffling I suppose to non-Americans).
And one last thing in my own defence: everyone always says that all I do is criticize. But I'm sure I've posted four or five posts saying something positive about a record, or simply stating a fact about it, for every one post I've spent rubbishing someone or something.
-
The Sprawl
- Known user
- Posts: 51
- Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 7:43 pm
I've just moved house and I logged on in mild curiosity as to whether or not I'd got a sensible, reasoned response from 26. Nope, just more hilarious, hysterical sniping, confused verbal flailings and another incongruous reference drawn from Bobby Gillespie's Big Book Of Cool References. Oh, and a complete failure, for a fourth time, to deal with my perfectly reasonable accusations of offputting and joyless record-collection-rocker snobbery. I wuv you 26, can I cut you out and send you in to Private Eye's Pseud's Corner?
Anyway, tediously cyclical internet-tastic arguments aside, I hope I haven't offended anyone to such a degree that a request for help in dealing with this messageboard would be ignored- this'll sound dumb, but I haven't the remotest idea how to post a topic or even if non leader type people can do such a thing.
My idea is simply this: what TV programmes does Jason Pierce watch(assuming he has a TV, which, I'll admit is a dubious assumption to make)? I freely admit that this is the kind of thing you'd find in Smash Hits, but I can't get rid of the image of him sitting down with a bowl of Doritos to watch Wife Swap, secretly wishing him and Dickie Ashcroft could sign up. Or maybe curled up on a beanbag watching that My Family show as something hilarious happens to the lanky teenager character who's meant to be funny.
Forget the state of music today, we have to deal with the genuinely important matters of the day.
Anyway, tediously cyclical internet-tastic arguments aside, I hope I haven't offended anyone to such a degree that a request for help in dealing with this messageboard would be ignored- this'll sound dumb, but I haven't the remotest idea how to post a topic or even if non leader type people can do such a thing.
My idea is simply this: what TV programmes does Jason Pierce watch(assuming he has a TV, which, I'll admit is a dubious assumption to make)? I freely admit that this is the kind of thing you'd find in Smash Hits, but I can't get rid of the image of him sitting down with a bowl of Doritos to watch Wife Swap, secretly wishing him and Dickie Ashcroft could sign up. Or maybe curled up on a beanbag watching that My Family show as something hilarious happens to the lanky teenager character who's meant to be funny.
Forget the state of music today, we have to deal with the genuinely important matters of the day.
I'll press a point home for the umpteenth time. EVERYone here is guilty of 'record-collection-rocker snobbery'. We wouldn't be here otherwise. We care about music. We value it and we want to talk about it. The people that really get my goat are those who when you ask what kind of music they like say 'oh anything really'. Bollocks - these are people who don't really care about music, people who simply and lazily digest what the companies throw at them without any REAL regard for its worth. The record companies think for them as the public can't be arsed to find any interesting music for themselves. 99% of the music this audience buys is terrible. I challenge The Sprawl not to have an extreme opinion about music some of us here love. Take myself: The Damned's Machine Gun Etiquette contains some of the greatest psychedelic guitar ever played; Fleetwood Mac's 'Tusk' LP is a magical triumph from start to end; 999's 1st album is as close to perfect a record as I've ever heard; Black Sabbath were fab; Abba's 'Dancing Queen' still doesn't sound dated today; some of Appleton's songs are ace; Primal Scream are a band who had one decent album in Screamadelica but that was actually a Weatherall solo LP with them as a backing band and every single other second they've recorded is utter shit; Blancmange were a great pop band; The Beatles Ob-La-Di-Ob-La-Da is great; UB40 had their moments; Ringo Starr had a great voice. Sadly for me I agree with all these statements and I could go on. We all have moments of idiocy and moments of inspiration - the point is we care enough and believe enough to stand by them.The Sprawl wrote: Oh, and a complete failure, for a fourth time, to deal with my perfectly reasonable accusations of offputting and joyless record-collection-rocker snobbery.
The important thing about everyone in the Spiritualized message board community is that we care more than the average music fan. For that people as diverse as $26 and The Sprawl are to welcomed, congratulated and embraced - this forum would be all the poorer without you. I refer you to the build up of opinions between Ian Goodchild and $26, both highly opiniated and highly informed. Took them a while to work out each other's space but I bet both are glad of the other's presence now in spite of the initial clash.
Just don't go thinking we aren't snobbed out about music because that's exactly what we are.
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Yes, it does sound dumb.The Sprawl wrote: - this'll sound dumb, but I haven't the remotest idea how to post a topic or even if non leader type people can do such a thing.
On the topic selection screen within a forum (in this one, it's http://www.spiritualized.com/message2/viewforum.php?f=1 ), click "NEW TOPIC", in the upper left-hand corner, underneath the word Music, the list of moderators, and the users in the forum.
See? We leader type people are of use sometimes.
If Bobby Gillespie is a fan of Clare Booth Luce, maybe I'm all turned around on Primal Scream.
They areant THAT bad.SpaceLine wrote: You can take mine personally though, radiohead blows.
Please.twentysixdollars wrote:See? We leader type people are of use sometimes.
By that I take it you dont like primal scream. Friend of mine is trying to turn me on to this band but its not working. Does this band have any good records?twentysixdollars wrote:If Bobby Gillespie is a fan of Clare Booth Luce, maybe I'm all turned around on Primal Scream.
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Well as Runcible said Screamadelica is quite strong. XTRMNTR is worth having if it can be obtained cheaply. The newer record isn't very good. The less said of their stonesey trad record the better.Clownbait wrote: By that I take it you dont like primal scream. Friend of mine is trying to turn me on to this band but its not working. Does this band have any good records?
The Jesus and Mary Chain's first LP is better than any of this, though.
-
BzaInSpace
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3864
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: HELL
If you mean 'Give Out But Don't Give Up', I think thats my favourite of all the Scream albums.
Its a fucking weird album... I love it.
A lot of funk on this album...the rock is a bit overcooked but the bluesy songs are beautiful...despite almost not working.
'Echo Dek' is good too and 'Vanishing Point' is a classic.
I have never heard 'Sonic Flower Groove', but everything else, including 'Evil Heat' gets a shakey thumbs up...
Its a fucking weird album... I love it.
A lot of funk on this album...the rock is a bit overcooked but the bluesy songs are beautiful...despite almost not working.
'Echo Dek' is good too and 'Vanishing Point' is a classic.
I have never heard 'Sonic Flower Groove', but everything else, including 'Evil Heat' gets a shakey thumbs up...
-
BzaInSpace
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3864
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: HELL
runcible wrote:The people that really get my goat are those who when you ask what kind of music they like say 'oh anything really'. Bollocks - these are people who don't really care about music,
.
I usually answer this way, I must confess. I mean it depends on whose asking really, but what can you say if you like all kinds of music, as most of us do?
It's always a big question. And one that really throws me and seems to catch me off guard every time it's asked.
So what music do you like? - Uhh, well, um all sorts really.
I don't know what else to say, other than try and remember an A-Z list of my collection. If I say 60s and 70s, then am I giving the impression I like Cilla Black and Wizzard, rather than The Electric Prunes and Free?
And if I do, then that neglects all the country, folk, blues, acid rock, r'n'b, rap etc that I like.
(and if I say country will they think I like Kenny Rogers and Garth Brooks?)
So my answer always comes out the same.
I need a good answer. Help me here people.
Surely you've missed out some stuff you like in that list.runcible wrote:Take myself: The Damned's Machine Gun Etiquette contains some of the greatest psychedelic guitar ever played; Fleetwood Mac's 'Tusk' LP is a magical triumph from start to end; 999's 1st album is as close to perfect a record as I've ever heard; Black Sabbath were fab; Abba's 'Dancing Queen' still doesn't sound dated today; some of Appleton's songs are ace; Primal Scream are a band who had one decent album in Screamadelica but that was actually a Weatherall solo LP with them as a backing band and every single other second they've recorded is utter shit; Blancmange were a great pop band; The Beatles Ob-La-Di-Ob-La-Da is great; UB40 had their moments; Ringo Starr had a great voice. Sadly for me I agree with all these statements and I could go on. We all have moments of idiocy and moments of inspiration - the point is we care enough and believe enough to stand by them..
I agree "Oh I like all kinds of music" is an awful, undefined trite reply - but what is the answer?
(Incidentally, when I was younger it was a lot easier. I'd just say "Nothing you've heard of" because the people asking were into Dire Straits, Level 42, and all those Live Aid bands, so I might as well have made up band names than told them Jesus & Mary Chain, Primal Scream, Spacemen 3)
-
twentysixdollars
- Known user
- Posts: 1319
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
I don't get asked as much as I used to; by virtue of having a large social circle of people I've known for ages there's not much need for me to make smalltalk with the hoipolloi, which leads to questions such as those. I used to tailor the response to the crowd: snobs got "folk and jazz"; hippies got "psychedelia and garage-rock"; indiekiddies got "experimental pop" and a cold stare; record freaks got "soul and R&B", and the like.
Lately I've just skipped genres entirely (because I don't like any genres totally - I just like certain artists within them) and tried to suppress my snobbery and obscuritanism; I offer the usual fingersnapping checklist: The Byrds, sure, Coltrane, Van Morrison, the Beach Boys and Marvin Gaye, if I'm in enlightened company, the Velvet Underground if there's kids around.
Lately I've just skipped genres entirely (because I don't like any genres totally - I just like certain artists within them) and tried to suppress my snobbery and obscuritanism; I offer the usual fingersnapping checklist: The Byrds, sure, Coltrane, Van Morrison, the Beach Boys and Marvin Gaye, if I'm in enlightened company, the Velvet Underground if there's kids around.
cool will check em out.twentysixdollars wrote:Well as Runcible said Screamadelica is quite strong. XTRMNTR is worth having if it can be obtained cheaply. The newer record isn't very good. The less said of their stonesey trad record the better.
already got it.twentysixdollars wrote:The Jesus and Mary Chain's first LP is better than any of this, though.
-
BzaInSpace
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3864
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: HELL
twentysixdollars wrote:
indiekiddies got "experimental pop" and a cold stare;
When I met trad jazz heads I answered with "Goodman" and a Masonic handshake... for more space age jazzers the reply was always "Sun-Ra" while I wet myself
Honestly though whenever I get asked I just say
'ROCK N' ROLL' ... and leave them at that.
Or 'GERMAN TECHNO' just to baffle the fuckers!!!
ok so I got the following Primal Scream albums
Burning Wheel
Dixie Narco
Evil Heat
Give Out But Dont Give Up
Jailbird
Kowalski (Creation)
Miss Lucifer
Primal Scream
Screamadelica
Swastika Eyes
Vanishing Point
XTRMNTR
Do I really need this much primal scream? Anyone care to filter this stuff for me so I know where to start and where to go after that.
Burning Wheel
Dixie Narco
Evil Heat
Give Out But Dont Give Up
Jailbird
Kowalski (Creation)
Miss Lucifer
Primal Scream
Screamadelica
Swastika Eyes
Vanishing Point
XTRMNTR
Do I really need this much primal scream? Anyone care to filter this stuff for me so I know where to start and where to go after that.
-
BzaInSpace
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3864
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: HELL
-------------------------------Clownbait wrote:ok so I got the following Primal Scream albums
Dixie Narco
Evil Heat
Give Out But Dont Give Up
Vanishing Point
XTRMNTR
That's what you really need I believe. 'Dixie Narco' EP is great, contains the 10 minute track 'Screamadelica' and also 'Carry Me Home', a Dennis Wilson song. Is it still available??? If it's reasonably priced GET IT.
Also keep an eye out for 'ECHO DEK' - the dub version of 'Vanishing Point' that the term 'Queasy Listening' was invented for!
Otherwise the albums are all worth having, as I mentioned, 'Give Out But Don't Give Up' was slated at the time, but trust me, it's magic.
If you can only get one....make it 'Vanishing Point'.
Hey Clownbait,Clownbait wrote:ok so I got the following Primal Scream albums
Burning Wheel
Dixie Narco
Evil Heat
Give Out But Dont Give Up
Jailbird
Kowalski (Creation)
Miss Lucifer
Primal Scream
Screamadelica
Swastika Eyes
Vanishing Point
XTRMNTR
Do I really need this much primal scream? Anyone care to filter this stuff for me so I know where to start and where to go after that.
Looks like you've got some singles in there, but for the most part, I'd recommend the following:
Screamadelica
Vanishing Point (FANTASTIC album)
XTRMNTR
As far as Evil Heat goes, I like a lot of the tracks on there, although it's definitely not as good as XTRMNTR or Vanishing Point. It's worth a listen, although many people here will tell you it's not.
Hope that helps.
-
a beautiful noise
- Known user
- Posts: 1783
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
- Location: things are easier said than done
-
unkle_karl
- Known user
- Posts: 46
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
I'd say xtrmntr is by far the best album, but screamadelica and vanishing point both well worth getting. Evil Heat is, umm, so so.
Anyone here seen the scream lately? Been reading some odd stuff about them, shambolic gigs etc.... heard on the radio today that mani stormed offstage during one of the V2004 gigs this weekend. Anyone know anything?
Kevin Shields returned with them though, so that's good news in my book.
Anyone here seen the scream lately? Been reading some odd stuff about them, shambolic gigs etc.... heard on the radio today that mani stormed offstage during one of the V2004 gigs this weekend. Anyone know anything?
Kevin Shields returned with them though, so that's good news in my book.
-
SpacemanRob
- Known user
- Posts: 250
- Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 8:33 pm
The world has finally gone insane. Praise for UB40???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
AND i find i finally agree with $26 when he rates the rock n roll splendour of JAMC.......
Everything is fucked without the normal safety barrier of narcotic indulgence....
I can only hope tomorrow i can once again enjoy the MOR shite $26 normally advocates and nobody alive and well ever mentions UB40....
Scary....
AND i find i finally agree with $26 when he rates the rock n roll splendour of JAMC.......
Everything is fucked without the normal safety barrier of narcotic indulgence....
I can only hope tomorrow i can once again enjoy the MOR shite $26 normally advocates and nobody alive and well ever mentions UB40....
Scary....
I have no narcotic influence so I guess I'm scary. I used to enjoy some UB40 in my youth ('Sing Our Own Song, 'Don't Break My Heart'). The fact that you have responded and I have put my cards on the table shows why we are both here. Your 'record-collection-rocker snobbery' is at the fore and shown very nicely with your latest post - you've taken the bait spectacularly.
If you can genuinely tell me you have never listened to some trash which still occasionally raises a tinge of nostalgia then you aren't a music fan.
BTW some of UB40's Present Arms in Dub is quite effective, if a little amateur in its approach.
...and this is written without any negative aspect towards Rob as I enjoy a lot of what he has to say. But I think my initial point is beautifully illustrated here.
(wasn't I a good boy not to say anything about Primal Scream?)
If you can genuinely tell me you have never listened to some trash which still occasionally raises a tinge of nostalgia then you aren't a music fan.
BTW some of UB40's Present Arms in Dub is quite effective, if a little amateur in its approach.
...and this is written without any negative aspect towards Rob as I enjoy a lot of what he has to say. But I think my initial point is beautifully illustrated here.
(wasn't I a good boy not to say anything about Primal Scream?)