Cocksucker Blues

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will this do?
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Cocksucker Blues

Post by will this do? » Mon Oct 11, 2004 3:23 pm

A rare chance to see the official documentary of the Rolling Stones '72 US Tour...banned by the Stones as soon as it came out, and only (apparently) allowed to be shown once a year under strict 'exhibition' conditions.

Find out more - Google "Cocksucker Blues" - but be sure to include quote marks, to avoid links to...sites about sucking cocks...

It's at the Tate Modern at the beginning of December. If you want to go, for Dog's sake get yerself a ticket.

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Post by SpaceLine » Mon Oct 11, 2004 3:31 pm

I've got a pretty decent dvd of this film, watched it shortly after I read a Keith bio and was in need of a stones fix. Didn't do much for me to be honest, although well worth seeing once.

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Post by will this do? » Mon Oct 11, 2004 3:42 pm

Ok then...just let me know next time YOU've got some fireworks, and I can come round and piss on yours.

I'm, going to see it in a proper theatre! :P

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Post by SpaceLine » Mon Oct 11, 2004 3:51 pm

sorry man, wasn't trying to bring you down. Just that I always heard so much about this one and the myth outweighed the truth for me. I'll look forward to your review once you've seen it, see if my pissing was unjustified.

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Post by will this do? » Mon Oct 11, 2004 4:34 pm

No worries -I was just kidding you. I'd hyped it up to myself, and pretty chuffed to get tickets, but at the same time, I know it's just a film, pretty nasty and all. But this will be an event of sorts...official screenings are apparently limited to one-a-year, so that may trascend the poverty of the film itself...?

Then...you've seen it, I haven't. You're probably right, and I'll be delighted to let you know on the 6 December.

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Post by BzaInSpace » Mon Oct 11, 2004 5:39 pm

Anyone heard the actual 'banned by Decca' track itself?

Would it have been the weakest link in the golden age for Stones singles had it been released - or an underground classic?

Worth it maybe just to here Mick singing some of those lines...

MEMO FOR TURNER....

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Post by SpaceLine » Mon Oct 11, 2004 10:22 pm

is "banned by decca" the name of the album or something? I recall a cdr i got a few years back, called "the unreleased decca album" or something like that. It was from '72 i think, but not too good either if memory serves.

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Post by Horrorflick » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:18 am

I've felt like a fuck for years, but the Rolling Stones do absolutely nothing for me, nothing. I also think they should stop touring. (It's all fun and games until somebody breaks a hip onstage...)

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Post by spzretent » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:57 am

you can find Cocksucker Blues on numerous bootlegs. I probably have it 5 or 6 times over. Some versions sonically better than others.

The movie? I have a DVD too. Its prime era Stones and there is some really funny shit in it. It is apparent there was absolutely no editing process for this film.

The Stones are my favorite band of all time. While I think releasing new material is embarassing for them and may taint their legacy a bit. They are artists and still have creative juices flowing. They have earned the right to do whatever they want. That includes touring. I will always go see them except in the giant football stadium shows. I've seen enough of those. They are still shit hot in an arena and twice as hot in a club. 60 years old or not.

At least they didn't pull a Flaming Lips. :roll:

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Post by will this do? » Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:11 am

Cocksucker Blues the SONG was a contractural obligation to Decca which was to have been the last single. It was of course unrelease, because it was unreleasable (deliberately). I haven't heard it, but it has been officially released (albeit briefly) on certain compilations for release Germany (where the general population would presumably be unable to understand the 'offensive' language/unoffended by graphic 'sexual swearwords' anyway). Apparently it is a Mick'n'Keef only job, probably knocked up in an afternoon - like I say I haven't heard it, but I imagine Derek and Clive sing the blues.

Decca probably got their own back by releasing ever more shoddy Woolworths style compilations, reissuing the original albums with bastardised tracklisting, flogging early b sides and outtakes as singles (Jiving Sister Fanny) throughout the 70's.

The Film Cocksucker Blues is as you say only available as a bootleg; it was similarly designed to be unreleasable, mythical. Jagger helped with the editing they say, so obviously knew what the results were going to shape up as.

Its exhibition in a theatre is only allowable under strict conditions, one of which is that the director is present.

Like I say, I'll let you know - meanwhile, go to the Tate Modern website and get yerself a ticket.

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Post by spacey » Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:19 pm

coqsucker blues is alright, its mostly the roadies having laughs and taking advantage of skanky groupies, keiths 'telly out the window' routine outside, all he does is flake out in a cosmic drug ambience as jagger prances about backstage with tina turner and stevie wonder

the song is quite funny, jagger's tale of a rent boy in ''landaaaan tahn'' looking for business... an acoustic ode to soho and the seedy underbelly of the smoke... as mentioned before, decca requested 1 last single and album from the stones, so they p*ssed off the deal with a crappy touched up live LP (such a shame the stones never released a *true* fully live LP in their 1965 - 72 prime era, the 'got live if you want it' lp was actually recorded in newcastle city hall and manchester wasnt it? not the albert hall, and jagger n keef were always too paranoid about their performances so they insisted on overdubs in the studio for live releases)

errr.. thats all..
--> i have in my pocket a hurricane fighter plane <--

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Post by will this do? » Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:48 pm

spacey wrote: ...so they p*ssed off the deal with a crappy touched up live LP ...
"Get your Ya Ya's out" is fantastic, if that's what you mean...the film Gimme Shelter was made on the same tour, and I don't think the soundtrack to that is touched up...

As for the stuff on "Got Live if You Want It", I don't think it's live stuff touched up, more studio outtakes over dubbed with screaming? And I doubt it was ver Stones paranioa/insecurity, myself. I doubt they knew anything about it. The era you're talking about, all (most) official studio work took place in Hollywood/Chicago, this would have given the record company free hand to do what they wanted - add in the impracticality/impossibility of making an effective releasable live recording in those days, with those PA's (more than likely unamplified backline/drums), with those audiences, this explains why we had to wait till the ROCK era for half decent live records (audiences sitting reverentially).

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Post by spacey » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:23 pm

how could they not know about overdubbing their parts and slyly fiddling with their live tracks released on vinyl... its been well documented that jagger and keith overdubbed their parts on ''ya-ya''s, keith was off his box as usual and sloppy in parts... i'd say it all came down to jagger more than keith, he was apparantly the one who veto'd the ''r'n'r' circus'' release after the who anihilated them on that

there were indeed some unused studio tracks (fortune teller, poison ivy) considered for adding crowd noise over, some of which appear on the 'got live' LP (the ep is fully live, from north west england '65 gigs of course)

gimme shelter isnt a particularly great set of performances or recordings, i dont think, obviously each to their own
--> i have in my pocket a hurricane fighter plane <--

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Post by TheWarmth » Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:07 pm

Yesterday some random dude at work gave me two tickets to see a one-night only showing of The Rolling Stones Rock and Roll Circus at Union Square Theatre here in NYC! Tremendous! The dvd is coming out today, so I guess they were just trying to promote it a bit. I really think the whole thing is excellent, EXCEPT (of course) for the Yoko Ono bit … so unsettling.

Also, in case anyone cares, I’m going to see the Libertines (minus Pete Doherty) tonight.

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Post by TheWarmth » Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:11 pm

spacey wrote:how could they not know about overdubbing their parts and slyly fiddling with their live tracks released on vinyl... its been well documented that jagger and keith overdubbed their parts on ''ya-ya''s, keith was off his box as usual and sloppy in parts... i'd say it all came down to jagger more than keith, he was apparantly the one who veto'd the ''r'n'r' circus'' release after the who anihilated them on that

there were indeed some unused studio tracks (fortune teller, poison ivy) considered for adding crowd noise over, some of which appear on the 'got live' LP (the ep is fully live, from north west england '65 gigs of course)

gimme shelter isnt a particularly great set of performances or recordings, i dont think, obviously each to their own
I STILL don’t agree that the Who “annihilated” the Stones at the Rock N Roll Circus. A Quick One While He’s Away is interesting, but it goes in so many directions and about only 1/3 of them are appealing. The Stones’ version of Jumpin’ Jack Flash is a little weary, but You Can’t Always Get … is excellent, as is No Expectations and Sympathy For The Devil.

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Post by SpacemanRob » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:24 pm

From my understanding Cocksucker Blues scared most of the Stones, in particular Mick, and this made it the underground classic it is. Mick became enormously conscious of his very obvious desire to mix in any room, to speak with any appropiate accent and for fear of ritual humiliation from Keith. To this end he buried it and will run scared from it in the future.
Apologies from the UK to The Warmth for wasting his money on the Liberitnes, now even more shite without the charisma and personality of Pete. Quite scary how a man can become a rock n roll star without the matching musical personality. Pete = Sid but with less conviction and more consumerism. Ready packaged rock n roll shite........ Scary but the limp and pathetic commercialism of Carl mentioning Pete in every interview makes you want to mash his head. Sad Sad Sad. However still preferrable to much of the shite about and all of Smile. Nice to see you back $26 you egotistical wanker....

Rock on.................

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Post by BzaInSpace » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:44 pm

Rob - what do you really think of :) 'SMiLE' ? :)

I didn't imagine it would sound they way it does - it's kinda strange.

I was used to the dense mono bootleg sound.

It dosen't sound as ...mysterious isn't the best word.

Where's 'George Fell In His French Horn' - FUCKING rewriting history - The Walrus Was Paul

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Post by SpacemanRob » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:03 pm

I struggle with Smile. Years ago Sonic mentioned it in Melody Maker and it should have felt good. Many great bands drop the name including JAMC etc....
Each time it feels wrong and sounds wrong.....
It seems too conservative and often dull. It never speaks and at times reminds me of motionless blandness....
Never understand how it can become such a supposedly iconic and legendary recors. Even the Monkee's Head sounds better....?
Rock on Spacemen but ignore BB....

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Post by will this do? » Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:33 am

So, now we’ve seen it.

Going to get into one of those ‘relativity’ debates I’m afraid: is it over hyped, over rated, or what?

Well I’d had my expectations pulled every which way. I knew it was a ropey old home movie…depicting wild scenes of Baccinalian excess…that wasn’t all that exciting…lots of miserable hanging around…great music…which you hardly hear…no editing…no editing…surpressed by a suddenly recitent/prudish Jagger…surpressed by a Jagger well aware of the value of myth…an ‘art piece’, by the great photographer of the Beat Generation, and unreleasable to a mass market in the same way as Burroughs writing is…

We had an excellent introduction to the screening by a curator, who revealed that Robert Frank’s print was unusable, so we were watching the Rolling Stones’ print (thanks to their generosity).

I was surprised by how coherent the film was. The titles began with a joke about how ‘the characters and events in this film are entirely fictitious…’ There was a set up bit about how the title came about…the film started with a look at Mick and Keith at a French Villa (?), doing press for Exile…there were genuine laughs to be had (ripples all round the auditorium), at the sense of boredom and the dry humour which resulted from having to answer endless stupid questions. Much of the humour throughout the film came from the moments of realisation on the part of the protagonists that they were involved in a pantomime.

Sex, sexual violence, drug taking. Well, you wouldn’t take a grown up to see it, but apart from the fact that it was real, it wasn’t that bad. I estimate about 9 or 10 nipples, 2 bush, 1 Beaver, 1 – 2 penii, 4-5 toots (Coke), 1 jack-up (H). Mild discomfort. Hangers-on carried out 90% of this. One of the Furry Freak Bros. turned up to state (post toot) to opine that Coke was too expensive to be habit forming (did I say he’d mooched his toot)- that one got a big YUK from the crowd.

The ennui was so well filmed, and was never boring to watch. Really pretty fast EDITING saw to that. The picture quality/lighting was pretty degraded, but it was part of the look, so…

Concert footage was good too (never ‘audience POV’), interesting to compare to Gimme Shelter film from 2 years prior…though there is only about 15 minutes (out of 90) of it – the offstage stuff is so interesting you don’t really need more.

I guess seeing it at home would cause all sorts of problems. Firstly, the bootleg is likely to be poor quality. Second, you never really watch stuff like you do if you’ve bought a ticket. Third, you never really watch stuff if you know you’ve got a fast forward button.

Anyway, we walked along the South Bank, over Hungerford Bridge, and had a walk round Soho for an hour or so, checking it all out, grabbed a bite, then walked back to Waterloo to the car, and drove back to Kent (why are there traffic jams in New Cross at midnight?). It was a good night.

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Post by TheWarmth » Tue Dec 07, 2004 2:47 am

SpaceLine wrote:is "banned by decca" the name of the album or something? I recall a cdr i got a few years back, called "the unreleased decca album" or something like that. It was from '72 i think, but not too good either if memory serves.
Really, you don't dig "The Unreleased Decca Live Album"??? I bought that a long time ago on a whim and I love it! Seems to me that it's prime time live Stones. Quality is pretty damn good, too.

Also, Memo From Turner is available on that three-cd stones set, "Singles Collection: The London Years," and was also released as a Mick Jagger single (see the sleeve and reviews here: http://rateyourmusic.com/view_album_det ... _is_224148). Fucking great song.

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Post by anorthernsoul » Mon Oct 16, 2006 12:27 pm

i thought i'd pump this thread up again. not so much out of discussion but more out of lazy requests. there was talk on the other thread about there being bootlegs of cocksucker blues in better quality than i'd ever thought were available. does anyone have a copy? that they'd want to send me? i've only seen it once, but i was reading jim jarmusch's praise of it last night and am in the mood to see it again ...

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Post by spzretent » Mon Oct 16, 2006 2:33 pm

I have bought a few dvds from this guy. not had any problems and they are pretty inexpensive.

http://www.greatdvd.org/

and you can pay via paypal so you are covered too.
http://www.lilmoxie.com
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Post by a beautiful noise » Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:23 pm

i know this is gonna pain you northern, but i passed on a copy of 'cocksuckerblues".

yes that means that the record show was in town last weekend. but (and i'll tell you later) what passed it up for was well worth it.

but there is a bit of hope, they will be at the next record show in january and i guarentee you that i'll pick it up.


sorry

m
e

p/s- go see science of sleep. saw it again over the weekend.

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Post by davedecay » Tue Oct 17, 2006 2:13 am

spzretent wrote:I have bought a few dvds from this guy. not had any problems and they are pretty inexpensive.

h~~p://www.greatdvd.org/

and you can pay via paypal so you are covered too.
UGH, he can't even spell Alice Cooper correctly - don't support bootleggers, anyway!

I've downloaded a 2-disc set ("pay no more than £0.00!") and here's the info from the text file:

THE ROLLING STONES
"BIG Cocksucker Blues"

2 DvD Set
Video: NTSC 720x480 @ 29.97 fps
Aspect Ratio: 4.3 Fullscreen
Interlaced: Yes - BFF
Constant Birate: 8000kbps
Audio: Dolby Digital AC3 5.1 Surround
48000 Hz @ 448kbps

Newly Transfered Print - Best Available
Interactive Menus/Song Selection

BONUS Material

Saville Theatre 1969
Australian Tour Documentary 1973
Promos
Brown Sugar Clip 1973
David Frost Show 1969
Interviews With Mick Jagger
Mick And Biancas Wedding

:Comment from Cover:

With all the versions of this floating around out there,we decided to put out the best possible version we could find and here it is!

The video and the audio were re-mastered entirely along with all the bonus material making this THE definitive version.

ENJOY
4REEL PRODUCTIONS

Liberated by KoolKat Entertainment

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Post by spzretent » Tue Oct 17, 2006 3:16 am

yeah. fine. whatever.
i just thought i'd pass that info along if anyone was interested.
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Post by davedecay » Tue Oct 17, 2006 4:19 am

didn't mean to sound preachy, even though it came off that way.

i'll do a B&P if someone really wants a burn, i'm off to watch it now...

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Post by anorthernsoul » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:58 am

BONUS Material

Saville Theatre 1969
Australian Tour Documentary 1973
Promos
Brown Sugar Clip 1973
David Frost Show 1969
Interviews With Mick Jagger
Mick And Biancas Wedding
wowww ...
if that brown sugar's the pink suited top of the pops one, it's amazing. tour documentaries and everything.

i'm definitely keen to b and p you up, i'll shoot you a pm.

thanks for the info, too, spzretent, the site looked like it had some other interesting stuff on there ...

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Post by spzretent » Tue Oct 17, 2006 2:40 pm

no probs. reason I passed it along is because so many people have trouble dealing w/boot sellers and I know this guy is legit. even though he cant spell.
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Post by spzretent » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:34 pm

which gets me wondering how a female moderator may have responded to this?
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Post by ro » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:11 pm

I would have trapped you both under a glass & set you free.

I've got the key.

yeah.

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Post by spzretent » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:08 am

i like the male moderator approach. chase em' around with a tennis racket. :evil:
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Post by Maybe Las Vegas » Tue Oct 24, 2006 11:08 pm

spzretent wrote:I have bought a few dvds from this guy. not had any problems and they are pretty inexpensive.

http://www.greatdvd.org/

and you can pay via paypal so you are covered too.
I think you will be able to get most of that stuff for free if you look on
http://www.tapetrader.com
I have some of the Stones stuff, incl. Cocksucker Blues, although a different version [possibly inferior, I don't know, never having seen any other version!]to the 2disc one mentioned in this thread, and some Spiritualized. My site is at http://www.tapetrader.com/Jol1
I think CB is just about interesting enough to watch once but is a pretty poor film, about it's only redeeming feature is fromk my point of view is that I mentioned it at work - it was really funny to see the shocked reaction until I told them it was a documentary about the Stones - even then one person couldn't bring herself to say the title. The song is also a good one to sneak onto compilations, but is pretty corny really.

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