Premier League / Football / Etc...

James T · Post by **James T** » Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:48 pm

I thought they did have to pay, though the club just agreed to let him go cause he wouldn't play for them anymore or something strange? Always tough to judge people coming out of the Scottish league, and a few others of course. Have they found their level, or are they ready for the next? Guidetti is a good example, did incredible in Holland, doing well in Scotland; but couldn't even get a game at Stoke and seemed to have a bad attitude about the whole thing?

olan · Post by **olan** » Wed Jan 14, 2015 6:41 pm

James T wrote:I thought they did have to pay, though the club just agreed to let him go cause he wouldn't play for them anymore or something strange? Always tough to judge people coming out of the Scottish league, and a few others of course. Have they found their level, or are they ready for the next? Guidetti is a good example, did incredible in Holland, doing well in Scotland; but couldn't even get a game at Stoke and seemed to have a bad attitude about the whole thing?

IIRC, Everton paid a nominal fee to Spartak Moscow to move McGeady's transfer forward several months. Seems like a poor bargain, on the other hand Naismith came directly from Scotland and has been fantastic (after a slow start when we played him too deep) and cost £0 due his contract being void when Rangers went bust. I can't understand why McGeady is being played in front of some of the other players (e.g. Atsu, although he is away at the African cup with the controversial acronym

or Oviedo). The good news is that McGeady will be suspended from the WBA game and hopefully relegated to the bench thereafter as he has been the source of much angst in my house over the past few weeks.

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Sun Jan 18, 2015 6:30 pm

I had a bad feeling leading to today's match. Arsenal is at full strength (Giroud, Ozul and Ramsey) and City had not been playing well. I liked that they didn't sit on the one goal, but kept on attacking in the second half, Ramsey played a good match. Boney was sorely needed today, as Jovetic was an absentee. I think he'll be away until mid-Feb. depending on how well his country does in the ANC.

James T · Post by **James T** » Tue Jan 20, 2015 1:21 pm

I didn't see the whole game as I was away in Brussels, but I did see from 30th minute until about the 80th. I think we dominated for periods, though it sounds like Arsenal started off the better of the 2 sides. We just had no end product at all, and I have finally had to come to terms with the fact that Navas is not good enough. I am forever finding myself absolutely furious with hi throughout games, he can't shoot, he can't even cross particularly well. He has a lot of pace, but he barely ever uses it to go past people. He wins a lot of corners, that is about it (then he takes the corner and it is almost always terrible).

I had a really bad feeling about this game also, but like kompany says, it could really give the team a kick up the arse. We went on a really great run, but in many of those games we looked well short of top gear. Will have to see what happens with the Chelsea game.

I went to see Anderlecht play Lierse at the weekend, a good performance and a 3-0 win. Some awful tackling throughout though. They looked pretty shaky at the back, so it was probably a good thing they were playing a bottom-of-the-league side who also had a man sent off for a shocking tackle. There was also a penalty to open the scoring, and a beautiful goal just before half time. An eventful game at the Belgian champions, and all for £18!

Atmosphere put the bed the generally accepted opinion that European football crowds are much better than those in England. Behind the goals were noisy and bouncy, as you see at most premier league clubs, but the main stands were pretty normal. Some patches of empty seats perhaps promised to sponsors, and a bulk of the crowd left about 5 minutes early to get home.

The Dr · Post by **The Dr** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 11:09 am

Eric Cantona's kung-fu kick: The moment that shocked football

"Eric had a fuse on him. There is no doubt about that. Ultimately he exploded…" (former Manchester United defender Gary Pallister)

"People have said this is the most famous common assault case in the history of the English legal system." (former United director and solicitor Maurice Watkins)

Twenty years on, the kung-fu kick former Manchester United striker Eric Cantona launched at Crystal Palace fan Matthew Simmons, moments after being sent off at Selhurst Park, still resonates as one of sport's most extraordinary events, even by the standards of football's melodramas.

The Frenchman was already an icon at Old Trafford after inspiring them to successive league titles, the first ending a barren run of 26 years, after his arrival from Leeds in November 1992. This retaliatory act of violence, which he never attempted to defend, merely added to his legend.

In a special show from 19:30-21:00 GMT on Thursday, 22 January, BBC Radio 5 live will explore in detail arguably the most shocking episode in Premier League history.

Former United players Gary Pallister and David May, then club director and solicitor Maurice Watkins, former United head of security 'Ned' Kelly, ex-Palace manager Alan Smith and Palace supporter Cathy Churchman recount the story of the infamous incident, the subsequent court appearances, and Cantona's celebrated "seagulls" quote.
A figure of hate… wearing black

25 January, 1995. Defending champions United travel to south-east London in second place, two points behind leaders Blackburn, who they had beaten 1-0 at Old Trafford three days earlier with Cantona scoring the winner. Victory at lowly Palace would return United to the top of the league.

Pallister: "Eric was always the number one target for supporters around the country. It wasn't just players who tried to wind him up but fans felt as though they could do it as well. Some of the abuse he got was terrible. Eventually it took its toll on him I think and it all came to a head that night. He was such a hate figure because he was such a good player."

Smith: "What distinctly hit me was that they played in all black that night. None of them had shaved and they looked a pretty ferocious team. I was thinking 'this is going to be a long evening'."
Eric Cantona holds his arms aloft as Crystal Place defender Richard Shaw falls to the ground

Cantona was having a running battle with Richard Shaw (grounded) throughout the match

Palace centre-back Richard Shaw is given the job of man-marking Cantona.

Smith: "Shawsie had this sort of bubbly, curly hair. He put a load of grease on. He used to put a lot of Vaseline around his face and mouth. He was the most charming, gentle guy you could ever meet but he looked pretty ferocious on the field. I think he was really up for marking Cantona."

Cantona is the subject of a series of hefty challenges, from Shaw in particular.

Smith: "If you want to say 'gave him one', Shawsie certainly went in. I don't have a lot of sympathy with Cantona. He is a big man, carries himself well, and he had given a fair amount out. Shawsie just thought 'it's on the halfway line, it's in front of the dug-out - I'll go for it'.

Then United boss Sir Alex Ferguson: "[Referee] Alan Wilkie's inability to stamp out the disgraceful tackles from Crystal Palace's two central defenders made subsequent trouble unavoidable."
'There was this look... His eyes were seething'
Eric Cantona is shown a red card by referee Alan Wilkie

Cantona was shown a red card for the fourth time in his United career

In the 48th minute, Shaw comes into contact with Cantona as he chases a punt from keeper Peter Schmeichel and the Frenchman retaliates with a petulant kick. He is red carded and walks off down the side of the pitch, with United kitman Norman Davies escorting him towards the dressing rooms.

Churchman: "All of a sudden he turned and looked back; I thought he was looking at me. I had no idea where this other guy [Simmons] had suddenly appeared from. There was this look on Cantona's face. His eyes were seething. You just knew at that point he was going to do something silly."
Matthew Simmons (leather jacket) taunts Eric Cantona as Palace fan Cathy Churchman (red scarf, left of Simmons), looks on

Simmons (leather jacket) taunts Cantona as fan Cathy Churchman (red scarf, left of Simmons), looks on

Kelly: "This chap just came straight down the gangway and started screaming abuse at Eric. He was okay when the guy was effing and jeffing at him but I think he called his mother a 'French whore' and that was the turning point. The next thing I know Eric is over the barrier giving him a kung-fu kick and punches are flying."

Churchman: "All hell broke loose as he jumped over the barrier. I can remember falling into my 15-year-old son and Eric's boot just brushing past my coat. Everyone looked at each other saying 'oh my God, what just happened' It was all over in seconds."

May: "I was stood in the middle of the pitch and there was a roar from the crowd. You look over and… I just thought 'what the hell are you doing'? You run over to see what is going on. It is kicking off and it is a case of 'one for all, all for one'. Everyone joined in."
United defender Gary Pallister (far left) looks dazed as Roy Keane (16) runs towards Eric Cantona

United defender Gary Pallister (left) was too shocked to get involved as others ran towards Cantona

Pallister: "I think I was one of the only players that didn't run over. I just stood there in disbelief. I was more in shock at what I'd just witnessed."

Kelly: "I took it upon myself just to go straight down there. I pushed a couple of stewards out of the way and found my way into the dressing room and Eric was in there with Norman. I told Norman to get back out there and that I would take over from here."

With the ground in a state of heightened fervour, United go 1-0 up in the 57th minute.

May: We had a corner, I stayed up, got set up by Lee Sharpe and scored my first United goal. I thought 'here we go'. I was going to get a nice little bit of positivity in the papers the next day. That is all I could think of."
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Eric Cantona's infamous kung-fu kick

Cantona, meanwhile, is silently digesting the impact of his actions.

Kelly: "He was sitting on the bench next to his stuff, very quiet, shirt off, thinking about what has gone on. It was dead silent, you could have cut the atmosphere with a knife. Sometimes you step back and realise you don't say anything."
No hairdryer for Eric - May feels full blast

An equaliser from Palace defender Gareth Southgate denies 10-man United victory. The away dressing room is ablaze with recriminations.

May: "The manager is ripping heads off everyone... Big Pete (Schmeichel), Big Pally, myself, Sharpey, Paul Ince. He had a go at me for their equaliser. He said, 'who the hell was marking Southgate?'. I said 'Eric'. He turned round and said 'Eric, I am disappointed in you. You can't be doing those things'. I thought 'Is that it? Is that it?!' Any other player would have been given the hairdryer. I just got the hairdryer off the gaffer for not marking someone I shouldn't have been marking."

Pallister: "Eric was very subdued. He just sat quietly in the corner. He didn't really say anything. I think he understood the magnitude of what had happened. Everybody was trying to come to terms with how we were going to deal with it."

Kelly: "All the directors came in and were stuck in a corner - Mike Edelsen, Maurice Watkins, Martin Edwards - discussing the way forward."

Smith: "Afterwards, I saw Sir Alex and he shook hands and said, 'What the bloody hell was wrong with that then?' I said 'Alex, that's an everyday occurrence in Putney High Street'. Because of his tunnel vision for everything, he was even trying to put a case that Cantona had been badly treated. I just sort of said, 'No Alex, totally agree, nothing wrong with it. Everyday occurrence'."
Crystal Palace manager Alan Smith makes a point during a match in 2000

Smith returned to Palace for a second spell in 2000, after being sacked following their relegation in 1995

Kelly: We let everyone else go out to the coach then me and Eric came out together at the end. There were fans outside baying for blood but I was quite confident I could deal with it and you've got to remember Eric was 6ft 2in and from a rough area of Marseille - he could look after himself."

"We were getting reports Manchester Airport was packed with press but we made contact with security who told the driver where to go. We got Eric into the car on the tarmac and drove him to the car park, where he got into his own car and drove home."
The fall-out - crime and punishment

Sir Alex Ferguson, upset at the loss of two points and "enclosed in my other world" on his return home, only starts to fully digest the Cantona incident early the next morning.

Ferguson: "By 4am I was up and watching a video. It was pretty appalling. Over the years since I have never been able to elicit an explanation from Eric but my own feeling is that anger at himself over the ordering off and resentment at the referee's earlier inaction combined to take him over the brink."

Churchman: "I worked at a hotel group at the time. My boss phoned me to say he'd seen me on TV. Within an hour of me getting to work the next morning we were besieged by reporters. It was quite surreal seeing my picture all over the papers. But it hit home that I needed a new haircut, and a new coat."

Ferguson and members of the United board - chief executive Martin Edwards, chairman of the PLC board Sir Roland Smith and Watkins - meet at the Alderley Edge Hotel that evening to determine the club's response.

Ferguson: "We were unanimous that it had to be powerful enough to protect Manchester United's reputation and we agreed that we should impose a four-month suspension on Eric, which would rule him out for the rest of the season."

United also fine Cantona £20,000. The FA subsequently summon him to a disciplinary hearing and extend the ban to nine months, until the end of September, and fine the player a further £10,000.

Watkins: "I think the club acted properly in the way they handled it. Eric accepted the punishment we decided to impose. As you can imagine, there were all kinds of suggestions that the club should terminate his contract and all the rest of it. But the club felt that they had to stand by their player. That is why we were disappointed when, subsequently, the FA decided to heap on a greater punishment."
In the dock… and eating fast food in the cells

23 March 1995: Cantona faces assault charges at East Croydon Magistrates Court.
Eric Cantona arrives at East Croydon magistrates court with Ned Kelly (with moustache) alongside him

Cantona arrives at East Croydon magistrates court with Ned Kelly (with moustache) alongside him

Kelly: "Paul Ince [who was also in court, facing a charge of common assault, on the same day], took him down in his car and they went out on the town. The tabloid press were there with their cameras and got them leaving Browns [nightclub]I think it was, at 3am. I wasn't there, they went out without me. I drove down that night and the next day Maurice asked me where Eric was - he knew where they'd been because he saw the papers - and I don't think that helped his case, to be honest."

"We left the hotel, which was 60 or 70 metres away from the court and we had to run the gauntlet of the press. I just grabbed hold of his wrist and pushed my way through. We got him inside eventually and he was signing autographs."

Cantona is sentenced to 14 days' imprisonment.

Watkins: "You could have heard a pin drop when the sentence was imposed. Then, as you can imagine, it was mayhem. Everybody was stunned. Eric pleaded guilty. Even the prosecuting lawyer was very surprised at the decision of the bench because it did run counter to all the sentencing guidelines. One minute Eric was a free man, the next minute he was taken down to the cells. He was in the cells for three and a half hours."

Kelly: "I think Eric was in a bit of shock. We all were. I followed him down the stairs with the prison wardens and we went in and sat down together in the cell. One of the old police officers said 'don't have the food in here; I'll go and get you something from down the road'. So I gave him some money and he went down to McDonald's and got some Big Macs and French fries so we ate that and had a good laugh about it."

"I gave Eric my phone and he called his wife, and Marseille to tell his family. Then he said, 'I can't be bothered with this, I might be better if I just serve this 14 days and get it over and done with'. I said 'no way, wait until Maurice gets back'."

Watkins and his legal team apply for bail, which is turned down by the magistrate.

Watkins: "So we had to charge up to the Crown Court, which luckily wasn't too far away. We lodged a notice of appeal and made an application for bail."

The judge grants bail and sets an appeal hearing for the following week.

Watkins: "We didn't have a lot of time to breathe but at least we got him out and back home and we could start work on the appeal."

Kelly: "On the way back up we stopped at what used to be the Four Seasons at Manchester Airport and I said, 'Do you fancy a beer at Mulligans?'. Eric had a couple of beers before I took him home."
The appeal, the seagulls and fingers in doors
Eric Cantona arrives at Croydon Crown Court amid a throng of policemen for his appeal hearing

Cantona received a police escort to his appeal hearing at Croydon Crown Court

31 March, 1995. Cantona returns to Croydon, this time to the Crown Court, for an appeal hearing.

Watkins: "I had a bit of a problem because I had got a bad back. I just couldn't get out of bed. They were looking for me. I was trying to get some attention and in the end, the hotel doctor came for me and gave me a few jabs and got me back on my feet again."

Cantona is sentenced to 120 hours of community service. United then hold a news conference.

Watkins: "We felt it was important for Eric to say something. He wasn't too keen but he said 'OK, but I would like to say something'. Then we started drafting what he was going to say. He was scribbling on a bit of paper and he asked me 'what is the name of that big ship that catches fish'. I said 'that's a trawler Eric'. 'And the big bird that flies over the sea?'. 'A seagull'. Then he wrote it out and we had the famous saying."

"I think I knew what he was getting at, as did quite a lot of other people once they had analysed it. But he didn't want me to explain it. He was quite adamant about that. He said 'I am going to say this but I don't want you to explain what I mean'. So, off he went."

Kelly: "We were upstairs in one of the offices of these hotels. Maurice was there talking with the QC and I was looking out the window at all the press. Eric was with his agent - Jean-Jacques Bertrand - and he looked up at me and said, 'Ned, what do you call a fishing boat in England?' and I said, 'a trawler'. Then they started speaking in French so I didn't have a clue what they were saying. He then said, 'what do you call these small fish?' and I had a think about it before saying 'sardines'. Then he said, 'what is the English word for the birds that fly beyond them?' I said, 'seagulls' and that's how it started."

In a room packed with expectant journalists, the enigmatic Frenchman utters the following line, before promptly getting up and taking his leave: "When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea."

Watkins: [After the news conference] they dropped me off at my hotel but unfortunately I left my fingers in the door. The counsel slammed the door on it. I started off [the day] with an injection and finished it off with the doctor that night putting my fingers together again."
The ban - shooting pheasants in Hereford

Kelly: "The first thing we did was get him out of where he was living in the north side of Manchester. Mark Hughes had a spare house over in the Prestbury area and we moved him there out of the way and he stayed there until he left.

"It was a mistake," says Cantona. Football Focus meets 'King Eric'

"I was there to look after him, really. The abuse he was getting from other supporters was quite horrific. I found out he liked shooting and hunting and I had a couple of mates down at Hereford who did that and we went on to one lad's private property down there and shot some pheasants.

"His father was a keen outdoors man as well so he'd come over and I'd take them down to Hereford for a day of shooting then we'd drive up to Manchester that night. Towards the end of it, we went to local places around the Cheshire area and he was a hell of a shot."

Cantona did coaching sessions for children during the week at United's old training ground at The Cliff. But under the terms of his ban he was not allowed to play in any organised matches. United attempted to schedule a series of training games against local teams to keep Cantona involved, but were censured in a letter from the FA once the matches became public knowledge. Deeply frustrated, Cantona informed United he was moving back to France.

Ferguson: "The next morning I contacted Eric's advisor and told him I was ready to fly to Paris. We met at a restaurant in which Eric was waiting for us with [his agent] Jean-Jacques Bertrand and a secretary. There was no-one else in the place and the owner had put the ferme [closed] sign on the door. Eric was delighted to see me and to hear what I had to say… I believe he wanted me to put an arm round him and convince him that everything would be all right."
Eric Cantona celebrates scoring against Liverpool in his first game back from his ban

Cantona made a triumphant return against Liverpool and subsequently led United to the Double

1 October 1995: Cantona returns against Liverpool at Old Traffford, setting up a goal for Nicky Butt inside two minutes, and then scoring an equalising penalty in a 2-2 draw. He scores 13 more league goals, including the winner in five 1-0 victories, as United overhaul a 12-point deficit on Newcastle to regain the league title. Cantona also contributes five goals to United's FA Cup campaign, including the winner over Liverpool in the final, as they complete the Double.

Watkins: "Obviously it was a very unsettling time for him and he was out of the game for such a long time. But I think he came back stronger than ever. He was such an influence at the club."

Pallister: "He had his mind set that he wasn't going to return to English football because of the way he was treated. He thought it was unfair. But the manager was obviously very persuasive. He came back the same player, the same genius."

Interviews by Ben Smith and Simon Stone. Edited by Bryn Palmer.

sunray · Post by **sunray** » Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:59 pm

Great results today. Very worried for Liverpool now though....

James T · Post by **James T** » Sat Jan 24, 2015 5:16 pm

Pathetic, don't have a clue at the moment. 2/3 penalties should've been given, but you still have to score from open play if you plan on winning anything. Load of shit.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:23 pm

Don't normally do the fa cup bit going to make exception today & try n catch motd for the lulz..

Re cantona
Read the guardian coverage. One of the articles had tears in my eyes, was laughing so hard. Good stuff. Remember those times. Was crazy stuff. Great fun.
In hindsight Eric was hard done by at the time re the ban, but he has undoubtedly profited from the incident since then where the recipient of the kick has become the villain of the piece..

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Mon Jan 26, 2015 5:44 pm

No excuses should be made, City is not playing well. Unlike VanGaal who is complaining about the quality of the pitch at Cambridge. They probably just have one maintenance person mowing, watering and maintaining the pitch while at Old Trafford you'll have a staff of 20 ! Title is not lost, but doesn't bode well. I think Chelsea will win this weekend. City just doesn't have the quality and players right now.

The Dr · Post by **The Dr** » Tue Jan 27, 2015 5:11 pm

would you rather win the fa cup and get relegated or stay in the prem- lower mid table?

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:09 am

No cesc & no costa make Chelsea ripe for the taking..??
City won't get a better chance to close the gap. W/o having to rely on favours from others..

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 2:21 pm

Also, no Costa (just recently announced 3 match ban). I don't know still ...... City hasn't been playing well and even without Costa, Chelsea might still be a little better ? We'll see.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 3:27 pm

Drogba will kill them. Kompany's out of form/not match fit (maybe even on the wane tbh..??) . He's ripe for being destroyed by drogba.

Zabaleta will have a tough time containing hazard - could see Milner deployed on the right instead of navas for that shift.

In mf City have been weak all season. Cesc's absence might make a big difference, or it might help shore up Chelsea having to put extra muscle in there..
If Chelsea get their noses in front it's hard to see them getting beaten (tho just ask Bradford, huh?). I'd say Pellegrini will want a fast start try & get an early goal. Prob city's best chance of turning them over..

Is there any justified cause for optimism from city? They'll not be weighed down by the statue of yaya in mf so that might give them some fresh pep - but again that hasn't occurred yet so there's no reason to suspect it'll appear vs Chelsea.. Lampard could do it tho.. It is interesting - and interesting to see what city'll do about their midfield in the summer..

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Fri Jan 30, 2015 5:47 pm

I wouldn't say a weak season, but certainly up and down. More down than up at the moment. Injuries certainly played a part and I don't know if Aguero and Dzeko are quite fit yet for tomorrow ? When Bony plays next month, he may/may not make an impact ? New club, familiarizing with new players, Pellegrini's game plan may have an effect. I hope Lampard plays well tomorrow.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:24 pm

for 40mins that first half was dire fare. then two goals seemingly out of nowhere.

sad drog didn't start. remy's been ok, but kompany's totally rattled. i still think drog would be more effective battering ram but who am i to second guess jose, & remy did exactly what was expected of him - be a nuisance & get in behind kompany.

courtois was really poor for the equaliser. yea, cech has never been the bravest since his head injury but he'd have had more balls than courtois & would've cleared that ball.

but compare this game to the matches between the top two in spain, italy or even germany last night & it's such a scrappy disappointing affair. juve & roma served up the game of the season so far earlier in the year & el clasico + atletico are full of quality. this game has had a flash of brilliance from ivanovic's pass & hazard's presence but outside of that it's been two midfields cancelling each other out.. cesc would've made a big difference. matic is a class apart in the middle, super footballer.

be good to see hazard/kun both mking their cases for who is the best player in the league..
been more impressed by city's work ethic & crispness than i have lately but it's still not great stuff..

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Sat Jan 31, 2015 7:38 pm

I thought City played well tonite. It seemed like Kompany gave up on that play or pulled up to not concede a goal ? 15 games remaining, 5pts. is not much to make up.

Post by **spzretent** » Sun Feb 01, 2015 2:12 am

What a huge game. So big in fact it was on national tv here. Regular NBC. The channel airing the Super Bowl tomorrow. What really made it an interesting match was watching the subs come and being so full of adrenaline they couldn't pass the ball cleanly. It took most of them a few minutes to calm down and get into the flow of the game. I enjoyed it. I wish City would have pulled it out but I am glad they didn't drop any points.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sun Feb 01, 2015 11:10 am

I thought it was a letdown tbh. Chelsea were content w/draw from prob the get go. & while it was played a frenetic & frantic pace, there was a lack of quality on the ball.
Costa & Cesc's absences really impacted the game imo. Took away not only the box office appeal but also any semblance of nastiness & most of the creativity of Chelsea.
City were the better team on the day but not good enough to punish Chelsea's limitations unfortunately.

For Chelsea it may prove a missed opportunity. The gap is small & they're not as convincing as they were prior to Christmas. City are strong in the run-in & Bony should add a bit of spark to their challenge..

Chelsea are in a weird phase atm.. Will be interesting to see what Cuadrado brings. I think he's good & far more exciting that Willian.. But they just seem to be in a bit of a lull, despite grinding out results. The Liverpool game midweek is a convenient excuse & it's maybe something that needs looked at - hat game shouldn't have been scheduled ahead of the city game - not for the benefit of Chelsea, but for the benefit of the neutrals.. If that league cup game had been this week then Costa could've played vs Ciry & Chelsea might've actually went for the win.. Maybe not tho. Mourinho's always happy to stayed undefeated in these games, the wins a bonus unless he needs it.

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun Feb 01, 2015 6:37 pm

Disappointing from Chelsea, pathetic tactics but I guess they got a better point than we did. That said, I'm tired of dominating games and having no cutting edge up front. Hopefully Bony will shake things up and Aguero should be back up to speed soon.

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Sun Feb 01, 2015 7:32 pm

Arsenal Rising ! The Gunners and Saints will overtake ManU in the standings by next week.

Stuart X.Hunter · Post by **Stuart X.Hunter** » Mon Feb 02, 2015 6:00 am

spacemanrich wrote:Arsenal Rising ! The Gunners and Saints will overtake ManU in the standings by next week.

That's a bold statement...

Any thoughts on the form of the three teams you've mentioned plus Liverpool and Spurs?? If anything it appears that Chelsea and Man City are coming back to the pack!
Some Champions League fixtures just around the corner making for a tighter end to the season than there ever should've been.

olan · Post by **olan** » Mon Feb 02, 2015 4:46 pm

spacemanrich wrote:Arsenal Rising ! The Gunners and Saints will overtake ManU in the standings by next week.

Yep, especially after Southampton dealt convincingly with Swansea on the weekend

. Personally, I would have thought that Spurs, Arsenal and even Liverpool (if they can keep their forward players fit) are more likely to challenge United. I'm unconvinced by United's defence and central midfield. I think they will struggle to keep a top four place if everyone else gets going. I agree about Arsenal though, now that they are getting back their important players, they look quite impressive.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Mon Feb 02, 2015 6:40 pm

Arsenal? pfft.. anyone could beat villa 5-0 these days.

first decent team arsenal come up against they'll crumble again. they got lucky catching city on the hop. they'll prob get third or fourth again.

hope i'm wrong tho. one of the few teams i enjoy watching. ozil's pass for giroud's goal was one of those moments that i love in football. just sublime.
but even then.. villa playing a high line at arsenal?! wtf did they expect to happen? they'd catch them offside every time? bizarre set-up. naive doesn't even begin to cover it. hari kiri stuff. & they got duly duffed.

tho arsenal prob have a comfortable enough run for a little while - spuds at the weekend might give them a game, or could collapse..
whoever they draw after monaco in the champ league their only real test outside whenever they play chelsea/liverpool such is the standard of the epl currently.. credit to them i guess you can only beat what's put in front of you & they look capable of destroying most of the league at present. all those inside forwards wenger buys all seem to be coming fit & into form at the same time, for like the first time ever..

Stuart X.Hunter · Post by **Stuart X.Hunter** » Mon Feb 02, 2015 10:11 pm

Most people are unconvinced by United defence and midfield however they've conceded fewer than City, Arsenal, Spurs and Liverpool

The frightening thing will be when they start converting chances more freely...

However I agree there is an air of uncertainty at the back but equally and perhaps more evident is the uncertainty up front...

I think to maintain 3rd all 5 of Mata, Rooney, Di Maria, Falcao and RVP must start and the philosophy must be you score 4 we'll score 5...until next season when all the Galacticos come and the world as we know it returns to normal with plenty years of Red dominance.

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Wed Feb 04, 2015 10:11 pm

the man above is insane

Stuart X.Hunter · Post by **Stuart X.Hunter** » Thu Feb 05, 2015 6:44 pm

KingHarry wrote:the man above is insane

It's ok to talk about mental illness

olan · Post by **olan** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 12:59 am

Stuart X.Hunter wrote: I think to maintain 3rd all 5 of Mata, Rooney, Di Maria, Falcao and RVP must start and the philosophy must be you score 4 we'll score 5...until next season when all the Galacticos come and the world as we know it returns to normal with plenty years of Red dominance.

in general. However, after then thinking about it for a while:

. lat's face it that in the end it is really

especially the Galacticos bit.....

Just teasing mind.....

Stuart X.Hunter · Post by **Stuart X.Hunter** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 4:36 pm

Sorry, I meant the Galapagos

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 10:10 pm

Without going over old ground - how many people were inside City's ground today?

Looked about half full. Bizarre.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 3:50 pm

I noticed the crowd too & noted the attendance was 45,000.

The stadium is just too big. At the minute anyway. They're still not a club that commands the excessive day trippers of the big clubs. They draw a healthy average crowd. It's the seeming indifference to champions league fixtures that's more querysome.
Rome wasn't built in a day & all..
The fans maybe need to organise themselves & make themselves noticed a bit more too..
Terrible result & performance from city tho. Need some work done in summer. Some players moved on, replacements found. Nasri/Demichelis, clichy..?? Fernando? Fernandinho? Yaya?!

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:41 pm

I have a season ticket and missed out on tickets for Barcelona at home. Empty seats are not worrying because they're still selling the tickets. Hotel+ticket packages, corporate seats etc... are what leave seats empty, and that is really annoying. Ground didn't look empty apart from towards the end, not sure why anyone outside of the club could give a shit to be honest.

Clichy has been great this year, despite my thinking he is way past his best. Can't play Ferna and Fernando together, but been forced into it. Nasri was slow getting into it but he's been out a while. Shouldn't drop Navas after his best performance for us in the Chelsea game, even if I don't like him usually so much. Glad to see we didn't opt for the Lampard option though which would've slowed the game down too much.

Good job united didn't win to make up more points.

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:03 am

James T wrote:I have a season ticket and missed out on tickets for Barcelona at home. Empty seats are not worrying because they're still selling the tickets. Hotel+ticket packages, corporate seats etc... are what leave seats empty, and that is really annoying. Ground didn't look empty apart from towards the end, not sure why anyone outside of the club could give a shit to be honest.

Clichy has been great this year, despite my thinking he is way past his best. Can't play Ferna and Fernando together, but been forced into it. Nasri was slow getting into it but he's been out a while. Shouldn't drop Navas after his best performance for us in the Chelsea game, even if I don't like him usually so much. Glad to see we didn't opt for the Lampard option though which would've slowed the game down too much.

Good job united didn't win to make up more points.

Just as a correction to my initial post - originally I only saw footage of Milner's equaliser on the news, hadn't realised it was so late on - at which point half the crowd had gone home by the looks of it.

In terms of people outside the club taking an interest - it's of interest to me because we keep hearing from Scudamore that it's the best league in the world and that pricing is at a fair and reasonable level, 'proven' by the 'fact' (his words) that ground fill rates are higher than ever - when your own eyes are telling you something different. I noticed Villa's ground was well below capacity v Chelsea and believe that you can basically walk up to Utd these days.
I made the point re City as that ground often looks less than full - but to be fair it seems that it often looks worse as it starts to empty on mass well before final whistle whatever the score.

James T · Post by **James T** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:52 am

It is a bit crappy that grounds empty a bit early, but the same thing happened when I went to a sold out Anderlecht game the other week. Patches of empty seats throughout and then half empty with 5 mins to go. If I am travelling home by car, I always leave city once the added time board goes up, otherwise you're stuck in a jam for literally an hour +.

The Dr · Post by **The Dr** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 12:08 pm

there are a lot of americans on this site but it only seems to be the prem that is discussed. i heard atlanta has bought new franchise for the mls from 2017. there is a problem in the us with the bigger stadiums not being filled (american football/baseball) with football crowds so smaller stadiums are being used. the thing i was listening to (an american expert) said that atlanta is not a city known for sport so i was wondering what the us thought about mls, atlanta, the expansion to include toronto and montreal, david beckham buying a franchise, the success of european players in the us etc

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 3:36 pm

Wish I was a professional footballer in the mls - or that new Australian league. Life of bloody Riley that lot.
To be 10 years younger..

Post by **spzretent** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 4:14 pm

I dont follow MLS at all. We have no team in Detroit. Markets that do well are those that dont have all the other major pro sports leagues ie: Columbus, Portland, Seattle and all the cities with really large younger ethnic populations like Chicago, Los Angeles and New York.
Atlanta is a terrible sports city. They have lost 2 NHL franchises. Their baseball team doesn't sell out their playoff games. Miami may work because of the huge Hispanic population.
In Detroit we have a team in a lower league who routinely sell out games. Capacity is only 3000 but it is a great night out.
Soccer is a long way from filling Baseball/Football sized stadiums out. That is why many of the MLS stadiums are around 25,000 capacity. That is in cities where soccer specific stadiums have been built.
There are simply too many other options here. I didn't even mention College sports which are also huge here.

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Wed Feb 18, 2015 1:35 pm

I, also don't follow MLS and didn't know about the Atlanta franchise. I knew about Beckham and his desire to have one in Miami. Miami would work, because of the hispanic population as previously mentioned. They are really kinda driving ' soccer ' in this country. I think the San Jose Earthquakes and Seattle Sounders do well in terms of attendance. But no, as a whole it's not there yet with american football and baseball. Those friendlies in the summer draw a lot of soccer fans who want to see the InterMilan, Chelsea, Real, etc. As regarding Atlanta, I don't know if a soccer franchise would work there ?

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Sat Feb 21, 2015 7:26 pm

City played well, especially Dzeko. I like their chances on Tuesday against Barca. Definite foul by Barnes, leg breaking foul that wasn't caught by the ref. Matic definitely cost them 3 pts. today. Gap is now only 5 pts.

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Tue Feb 24, 2015 8:19 pm

2 up front v Barcelona?

Good watch this

Post by **runcible** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:59 am

I thought Man City's spirit was admirable after being hit so hard in the first half against Barca. The sending off killed the game which was a shame as that last 15 minutes or so would have been really exciting. But an entertaining watch nonetheless...

James T · Post by **James T** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 10:25 am

When City play like we know they can, they tend to score more than one goal. We have to play with conviction in Barcelona and hope we can contain their attack to restrict them to no more than one goal. We can definitely win it 2-1 on our day, but I wouldn't fancy us in extra time anyhow.

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:13 pm

Once Barca went up 1-0 their ball possession and passing were superb. Terrible fouls by Clichy and Zabaleta. I don't say this too often, but great save by Hart. In fact, he played well last nite. Not too optimistic about the next leg, though ...

cantona · Post by **cantona** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:51 am

It just shows how far behind the english teams are falling though. City last night and Arsenal tonight have been totally outplayed.
Chelsea also had their problems with PSG.

Incredible with so much cash that english clubs can't do it better.

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 4:39 pm

cantona wrote:It just shows how far behind the english teams are falling though. City last night and Arsenal tonight have been totally outplayed.
Chelsea also had their problems with PSG.

Incredible with so much cash that english clubs can't do it better.

I do enjoy seeing it happen. Still can't shrug off the feeling that Chelsea will do well though.

They have that unpleasant ability to hang in games and win when they have no real right to do so.

cantona · Post by **cantona** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 4:49 pm

I can also see Chelsea go though because Mourinho know how to defend.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sun Mar 01, 2015 2:38 pm

End of the line for Mr Pellegrini & a fair few of that city squad..

That countinho's amazing. Always showed flashes at inter but has really grown these two years at Liverpool. With a few more moments like the last two weeks he could become one of the worlds best. There's something special about him, great on the ball & his passing in particular is top class. But the goals he's scored recently hint at something else coming to his game.

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun Mar 01, 2015 4:37 pm

Credit to Liverpool but City made it SO EASY for them in the second half to keep coming forward. You can;t win trophies every year but its the manner of some of these defeats that concern me. Nasri and Zabaleta were really poor today. Kompany had a shocking first half but I think the back 2 had a great second half.

Not often said, but I think the ref had a near perfect game today. I hate Clattenburg with a passion but couldn't fault him this time round. Let the game flow well.

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:05 pm

LIVERPOOL ARE FUCKING BOSS

It's just so ace when they win

Fantastic stuff. On the back of Thursday's dispiriting marathon in the furthest corner of Europe, pretty much remarkable.

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Sun Mar 01, 2015 9:22 pm

jack white wrote: That countinho's amazing...There's something special about him

It's unfortunate that you start to fear the inevitability of his leaving. He is an absolute gem - but in the SkyTV rush to acclaim Sterling he's been somewhat overlooked in the wider public eye. That's certainly changed now and he will be in demand. His most obvious weaknesses have been (a) an inability to shoot (b) being a bit of a homer - but 3 recent 30 yard screamer winners and stand-out performances at Chelsea and Southampton bode well.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Tue Mar 03, 2015 10:58 am

Rafa to City?! Would love it if that comes off. Miss Benitez in the prem & at a high profile club like City I'm sure he'd bring the lols. All you'd need is Lord Ferguson to come out of retirement then the 4 loopers would be united again (Jose, Rafa, Ferguson & Wenger).

Please make it happen. Hapless Pellegrini is no fun.

James T · Post by **James T** » Thu Mar 05, 2015 1:58 pm

Pathetic turnout last night, you can all have your empty seat digs this time round!

Good performance though. Sure, Leicester were unlucky not to have a penalty or 2, but we were unlucky not to score 3 or 4 more. Result was the most important thing yesterday.

sunray · Post by **sunray** » Sun Mar 08, 2015 6:31 pm

Liverpool

Post by **runcible** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:16 am

Cracking cup tie last night at Old Trafford. Quite what Di Maria thought he was doing is beyond me and hats off to the ref for standing his ground and delivering a consistent performance throughout the game although I'll admit Bellerin was lucky not to get a 2nd yellow. I forgot the match was on actually and only stumbled into it at kick-off, but I really enjoyed it.

Liverpool Arsenal final?

James T · Post by **James T** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 11:39 am

Villa v Arsenal final, Villa to win. Often a surprising cup, and given results in earlier rounds it would be a shame if there wasn't another shock!

sunray · Post by **sunray** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 1:34 pm

James T wrote:Villa v Arsenal final, Villa to win.

I was thinking the same thing myself.

As for Liverpool? I think we'll fall short in the league as well as the cup. I've a feeling the two points dropped at home to Leicester over Christmas will prove crucial.

Post by **MODLAB** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 2:05 pm

James T wrote:Villa v Arsenal final, Villa to win. Often a surprising cup, and given results in earlier rounds it would be a shame if there wasn't another shock!

I don't think so. I think Arsenal will only focus on this and staying in the top 4 spots.

We can kiss anything else goodbye.

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Wed Mar 11, 2015 8:27 pm

sunray wrote:
James T wrote:Villa v Arsenal final, Villa to win.
I was thinking the same thing myself.

As for Liverpool? I think we'll fall short in the league as well as the cup. I've a feeling the two points dropped at home to Leicester over Christmas will prove crucial.

You're an optimistic lad aren't you?

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Wed Mar 11, 2015 8:32 pm

runcible wrote:hats off to the ref for standing his ground and delivering a consistent performance throughout the game

Thought the ref was really good. He's an unimpressive looking bloke, but showed he's got something about him - not in a 'look at me' Lee Mason type of way, but just a quiet authority and failure to be swayed by the increasingly farcical attempts by Utd to con him.

The Dr · Post by **The Dr** » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:17 pm

seems you can't bully your way through the champions league. bye bye chelsea

cantona · Post by **cantona** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 8:36 am

A game full of cheating, diving, holding, feigning injury, play acting, time wasting, intimidating refs, poor refereeing.It was never a red card for Zlatan and Chelsea should have a penalty.

My MOTM was Verratti.Works very hard and also a very good passer of the ball.Just what we need at Manchester United.

sunray · Post by **sunray** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:28 pm

KingHarry wrote:
sunray wrote:
James T wrote:Villa v Arsenal final, Villa to win.
I was thinking the same thing myself.

As for Liverpool? I think we'll fall short in the league as well as the cup. I've a feeling the two points dropped at home to Leicester over Christmas will prove crucial.
You're an optimistic lad aren't you?

I know, it's terrible isn't it! I find expecting little just ever so slightly lessens the crushing disappointments when they arrive.

Big three games coming up now: Swansea away followed by the double header with Man U and Arsenal. My nerves will be shattered!

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:44 pm

sunray wrote:
KingHarry wrote:
You're an optimistic lad aren't you?
I know, it's terrible isn't it! I find expecting little just ever so slightly lessens the crushing disappointments when they arrive.

Big three games coming up now: Swansea away followed by the double header with Man U and Arsenal. My nerves will be shattered!

Swansea feels like a key game. Tim Krul's mind-funk against Utd last week means there's no room for slip-ups. We're playing okay at the moment, but it's only the games v Chelsea in the cup and City recently where we've looked brilliant - many of the other games performances have been so-so - but perhaps that augers well for the big games coming up.
Be good to get Sakho back in and Sturridge properly firing again.
The return to full fitness of Gerrard is a concern - there will be monumental pressure for him to come back into the team, whereas he's patently no longer befitting a place in or strongest 11.

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:29 pm

Put a fork in it, City is done. Kudos to Chelsea, the title chase is over.

Arsenal and Liverpool have been playing better second half than City and I wouldn't be surprised
if City dropped out of the Top 4 with their playing lately. I really wouldn't be shocked.

I hope Pellegrini doesn't get sacked. Players have to play at the top level.

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun Mar 15, 2015 12:16 pm

Really poor again, although we dominated pretty much every stat we never looked like winning. We're useless at the moment when it comes to putting away chances. I would be surprised if we dropped out of the top 4, although I agree that it is a possibility if we don't start playing to potential. We need to focus on securing second place now, and we DEFINITELY don't want to finish 4th because I don't trust us to turn up and perform well in a qualifying round. A lot of arrogance in the way we show for games, the players expect to win. Yaya and Silva have hardly ever played worse than they did yesterday.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sun Mar 15, 2015 3:52 pm

City need a major overhaul of the squad & team. There's about 4 or 5 I'd keep (Milner being one of them). The rest are average, or have underperformed too long. Most of the mf needs replacing, you could make a case all the defenders need replacing (except the inexhaustible zabaleta).
Dzeko/jovetic useless. & Bony??

sunray · Post by **sunray** » Sun Mar 15, 2015 9:32 pm

What really impressed me about Burnley was that they had two players named Trippier and Yokes