Premier League / Football / Etc...

cantona · Post by **cantona** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 4:53 pm

I totally agree with him who wrote this:

In England as far as opinions sway, there are two teams. Man UTD and the rest... That's y the majority of people in England said the ref decision was justified. However, neutral football supporters outside of the UK know that the red card was completely outrageous and changed the game. Even Jose said the better team lost.

The best Danish reefs also agreed that this was not a red card.And do not forget Roy Keeane have been anti-united since his farewell.Great player but total cunt being controversial for the sake of it.

Post by **runcible** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:29 pm

You are missing the point. The red card was very tough but the ref was justified in showing it. And there have been plenty shown for less and none shown for loads more. If the ref had not shown the card UEFA may well have sanctioned him. So not 'outrageous', just harsh.

In the UK only Man U fans can't see why the card was shown - this sums up the arrogance that defines so many of them. Have you asked yourself why Nani rolled around on the floor after the incident? What possible reason would he have for doing that? The guy knew he was in trouble and you see endless players do the same thing. Therefore he was very much aware that there was a chance he'd be sent off. That kind of kills the argument.

Quite what Mourinho was up to is anyone's guess. That guys plays mind games with himself. So his view isn't to be even considered. Can you recall games when his team has been outplayed and beaten and he's said the best team lost? Of course. On the other hand if Madrid had lost I bet he'd have come out with a totally different view about how well his team played.

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:04 pm

Cantona, no need to let me know who your club is. By the way, Cantona is a c*nt, being French made it double worse and he looks like a cro-magnon to boot.

Hey, cleats up is cleats up. If they happened to a ManU player you would be up and arms about it too !

More the reason to hate ManU and old Fergie. Seems like the older he gets, the more arrogance. He can't seem to display sportsmanship nor congratulate the other team. With the draw w/ Chelsea, he stated " are side was fatigued " and couldn't congratulate them in anyway, including the handshake, thus snubbing Benitez - that's a cunt for you !

http://espnfc.com/news/story/_/id/13702 ... ub?cc=5901

I'm just waiting for someone to clock him to knock some sense into him ...

*** Note from moderators â€“ this user has been warned about use of language which could be construed to be racially offensive***

Post by **runcible** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:13 pm

Curiously the older he gets the more I respect Ferguson. He's a great manager and has built many brilliant teams so worthy of some respect, even though I can't say I like the guy. But the achievements speak for themselves.

Broc · Post by **Broc** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:29 pm

spacemanrich wrote:Cantona, no need to let me know who your club is. By the way, Cantona is a c*nt, being French made it double worse and he looks like a cro-magnon to boot.

Why is being French double worse? Please explain...

Are you the guy who has been pulled up here before for using racist/borderline racist comments? If so please fuck off.

cantona · Post by **cantona** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:34 pm

So you saying that because there have been mistakes made â€‹â€‹before so it's okay to show the red card?And do you really think he thinks I must also show the red card so I will not be punished?

You simply have only one agenda. what is bad for Manchester United is good for you.If this have been Spurs-Real Madrid and Bale versus Abeloa you and all abu would have said that the red card was wrong.Nani did not roll around on the floor. He was just lying there after both clashed. I think it was Martin Jol who said that if it was a red card Berbatov should be shown the red card ten times this season.

Post by **runcible** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:22 pm

cantona wrote:So you saying that because there have been mistakes made â€‹â€‹before so it's okay to show the red card?And do you really think he thinks I must also show the red card so I will not be punished?

No - the ref just followed guidelines for dangerous play, albeit in rather strict fashion. I'm sure you've seen red cards for much less.

cantona wrote:You simply have only one agenda. what is bad for Manchester United is good for you.If this have been Spurs-Real Madrid and Bale versus Abeloa you and all abu would have said that the red card was wrong.Nani did not roll around on the floor. He was just lying there after both clashed. I think it was Martin Jol who said that if it was a red card Berbatov should be shown the red card ten times this season.

Well I refer you to the comments I made about Ferguson. OK, Nani didn't roll around but he went down as if injured and received treatment when there was plainly nothing wrong with him. The point is he knew he was in trouble. I agree it totally changed the game.

Referees use their own discretion so they will all be different. That one punished one particular foul in surprisingly brutal fashion, but he was technically right. No action was taken against Juventus' defenders when they manhandled the Celtic players - some referees might have awarded a penalty.

I'll also throw in my confusion at spacemanrich's bizarre comments. What on earth are you trying to say?

KingHarry · Post by **KingHarry** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 12:34 pm

The whole thing is blindingly obvious to anyone other than Utd fans.

At 0-0 Madrid have a perfectly good goal ruled offside

Utd look plucky through-out and are gifted a fluke goal to take a slender lead.

At 1-0 Utd deny a certain equaliser by handling on the line

The referee then sends off Nani. I'd say it's a borderline yellow / red - no surprise whatsoever to see him go.

Utd and the national media explode into indignation and conspiracy at the injustice of it all. Any right-minded observer who has the courage to point out the actual events is labelled an 'ABU'. Ferguson mumbles some guff about having been knocked out of Europe in the last 3 years by referees. Ferdinand impersonates a 9 year old child at the final whistle. The rest of the country finds the whole thing hilarious

cantona · Post by **cantona** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:41 pm

KingHarry wrote:The whole thing is blindingly obvious to anyone other than Utd fans.

At 0-0 Madrid have a perfectly good goal ruled offside

Utd look plucky through-out and are gifted a fluke goal to take a slender lead.

At 1-0 Utd deny a certain equaliser by handling on the line

The referee then sends off Nani. I'd say it's a borderline yellow / red - no surprise whatsoever to see him go.

Utd and the national media explode into indignation and conspiracy at the injustice of it all. Any right-minded observer who has the courage to point out the actual events is labelled an 'ABU'. Ferguson mumbles some guff about having been knocked out of Europe in the last 3 years by referees. Ferdinand impersonates a 9 year old child at the final whistle. The rest of the country finds the whole thing hilarious

Manchester United have the ball on the post and full control of the match until the sending off.

I saw the match with several Real Madrid fans and no one complained about the off side decision.Yes Rafael is handling on the line but that happened after the sending off.

If Nani had to be shown the red card why do Lopez not getting a red card when knocked his hand into the face of Vidic?

Post by **runcible** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:36 pm

Man U fans just can't see it can they?

Why was Ferdinand not punished for sarcastically applauding the referee? Or for tripping Torres last weekend? Both would normally received punishment.

Swings and roundabouts... Man U have had enough dodgy decisions go their way but when one goes against them... whoo boy, better watch out...

James T · Post by **James T** » Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:00 pm

United fans thought it was hilarious when RVP got sent off for nothing against Barcelona, and that ridiculous sending off for Kompany also helped their way through the FA Cup game last year. Shit happens. He kicked his foot up high and was in no rush to pull out even after the ball had gone. Balotelli did the same thing against Kiev a couple of years back and the city fans blamed him, not the ref.

Just cause you had a player sent off, you have a lead in europe with about 35 minutes to go? You're good enough to defend and at least take it to extra time. Then in the chelsea game you play for about 10-15 minutes then switch off thinking it's all done. As soon as it turns pear-shaped- "oh t's the disappointment of the real game, it's hard to shake that kind of thing. Oh we're knackered after having to fight with 10 men in mid-week". You did the same thing against city and were extremely lucky to come out with 3 points after that pillock nasri popper the free kick in for you. It wasn't even a good free kick, awful! Still, you deserve the lead right now, shame city took so long to kick on and start getting in the good performances!

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Sat Mar 16, 2013 2:45 pm

City is done for the season, a 2-0 loss to Everton sealed the coffin.

Post by **spzretent** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:26 am

spacemanrich wrote:City is done for the season, a 2-0 loss to Everton sealed the coffin.

Here is a novel idea. Respond to those who have been offended by your numerous racially insensitive posts instead of posting the obvious in various sports threads.
Yes, us moderators speak to each other and exchange emails behind the scenes. You have a laundry list of offenses we have documented and when called out on you ignore yet you immediately respond to a pm calling us "petty".
If you had any idea the complaints we are sent privately and also the ones you choose to ignore publicy you might reconsider calling the moderators "petty".
Man up!

James T · Post by **James T** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:36 pm

All very quiet now

BVCP206 · Post by **BVCP206** » Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:26 pm

runcible wrote:Man U fans just can't see it can they?

Why was Ferdinand not punished for sarcastically applauding the referee? Or for tripping Torres last weekend? Both would normally received punishment.

Swings and roundabouts... Man U have had enough dodgy decisions go their way but when one goes against them... whoo boy, better watch out...

Sooooooo true, every word spot on. Ferdinands reaction was disgusting and he's got previous for that too, just accept it and stop moaning.

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun Apr 14, 2013 9:59 am

Off to Wembley now! Hope it doesn't end with the "long journey home". 3-1 blues

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sun Apr 21, 2013 8:19 pm

3-1 spuds

all very quiet now :p

citeh need a big summer. or a big kick up their collective backsides.

first order of business should be dumping nasri off in paris.decent goal today but his contribution this season has been abysmal. not that he's the only fall guy but defo the most high profile & truly talented waster (e.g. joe hart's just a clown & the likes of kolorov, lescott, barry, kolo toure, maicon are next to useless) .

for all the money spent the squad is too small to compete at the level they should be.

James T · Post by **James T** » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:39 am

Anyone who thinks Barry is useless need their head checking. He ran the game at Old Trafford this year and he was equally brilliant in the cup semi final. He might not be a week-in week-ot player as of next year but he is well worth keeping in the squad. I'm happy for Lescott to act as cover. We've got the best defensive record again this year and he's been fine when called upon. Even Kolo has one well when he's been asked this season, but I wouldn't renew that deal, he'll go.

Joe Hart is a very good goalkeeper, a few mistakes this year but don't overlook the fact he has been absolutely superb in more games than he has been iffy. Dortmund at home he was just incredible.

Thanks for reminding we spent some money, I'd totally forgotten about that. An FA Cup and 2nd place finish is a good season, it's just not a "great" season. If chelsea sacked a manager for that everyone would be in uproar again about it. You pay money and buy players to get to a certain level, you can't win everything every year. Well done united, they've surpassed expectations and done it all season. But to make out we're miles apart and we're not competing is stupid. Had we of won at our place (which we were very unlucky not to at least draw) that is a 6 point swing and united have tough games ahead. It's a 2 or 3 game difference.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:42 pm

don't be so snooty about the money comment. my point was it hasn't been spent wisely. it's an accusation i could throw at any number of clubs - arsenal (podolski), liverpool (henderson, downing), chelsea (torres).
but in relation to city's squad, it just seems very small in numbers & stature given the funds that were available (before the UEFA FFP crap comes in). i just don't see how they expected to match their ambition w/such a small squad.

re hart
we'll have to disagree
(so to barry)
i think hart has cost you much more this w/his mistakes & just plain bad goalkeeping season that he has contributed.
one of the problems is he has no competition, another being he is vastly overrated. e.g. 'if' you had signed lloris you'd be sitting a lot prettier.

about the only thing we agree on is that it hasn't been a great season

a 2 or 3 game difference is still 6 or 9 points. that's a lot. & as your own fans acknowledge it wasn't til the 94th min of the final game of last season you actually won the league - that is surely an alarming distance to fall behind in the title race. the idea city are competing or aren't that far off utd is delusional, no offence but the facts speak for themselves.

i think there's still a lot of work to be done to make city into a force. i thought the general consensus was they'd arrived at the top table & maybe they have. but they're not a major force by any stretch of the imagination. they could be, maybe w/the new guys behind the scenes player recruitment will improve. something (or a lot) needs to happen or they'll continue to backslide.

James T · Post by **James T** » Mon Apr 22, 2013 9:01 pm

City do not need to worry. United won nowt last year, we can still win a cup. These things happen. This is football. United have had an insanely good season in terms of points. I've watched nearly every united game, all the city games, there is very little between the two besides that attitude that has come with years of winning. But hell, if we played at old Trafford every week we'd walk the league

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sat May 11, 2013 7:10 pm

Bye bye Mancini.

& 6 or 7 city players. They could do worse than sign Callum mcnanaman..

Wigan were the better team. Only team bothered enough to want to win the game. Some of those city players seemed to feel it was beneath them.

Good stuff.

Wigan are going down tho. Won't really miss them but glad they won the cup.

olan · Post by **olan** » Sat May 11, 2013 7:45 pm

jack white wrote:Bye bye Mancini.

& 6 or 7 city players. They could do worse than sign Callum mcnanaman..

Wigan were the better team. Only team bothered enough to want to win the game. Some of those city players seemed to feel it was beneath them.

Good stuff.

Wigan are going down tho. Won't really miss them but glad they won the cup.

I'm a bit surprised at the tone Jack. OK, so City had a total off day, but credit to Wigan who played very well and did not give City the chance to do so. Give credit where credit is due....

As for not missing Wigan, I would rather watch them play than Stoke, Norwich, Sunderland (amongst other) and any team ever managed by Sam Allerdyce. At least Wigan actually try to play football.

Great performance by Wigan, but sadly their real Cup Final is on Tuesday at Arsenal.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sat May 11, 2013 8:50 pm

all fair points. i didn't mean to appear curmudgeonly towards wigan (just towards city

)

& yea i agree w/you on much rather watching wigan than norwich/stoke/sunderland or sam allerdyce. again i agree they do try and play football.
i would prefer them to stay up out of p much everyone down there w/them but they're just too calamitous too often to invest much into. again i'd hardly miss them, i'm more nonplussed over their destination whereas i'd be more proactive in my dislike for the others.

today wigan played good purposeful football when they had possession, maybe had a peno shout just before the goal & they defended surprisingly brilliantly w/o any of the mistakes or poor concentration that has undermined their league form.

i don't know about city having an off day as such - it seemed quite indicative of what i've seen of them this term. turn up & hope someone else does the hard work for you kinda thing.

i think my tone was born more of derision for the overall value of the fa cup & city's lackluster mood seemed to mirror that better than wigan's heroics. it shouldn't be that way of course & i am genuinely delighted for wigan. there's few more deserving of a trophy this yr than some of those guys like shaun maloney or james mccarthy. they have put in some outstanding performances consistently this season & it's good to see them being rewarded w their moment of glory.

olan · Post by **olan** » Sat May 11, 2013 9:12 pm

I was at Goodison when Wigan cleaned us out in the 6th round. Given that the semi-final was against Blackburn, the Everton vs Wigan game was almost a play off for a place in Europe. Wigan were fantastic then and fully deserved the win. They were as good today, if not better. Fair play to them. That was class today, not luck. It wasn't like City hit the post, bar etc and the Wigan keeper played a blinder. From where I was sitting Wigan simply played better than City.

Full credit to the City players who stood and applauded the Wigan team back on to the pitch after the Cup was presented. Outstanding stuff......

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun May 12, 2013 11:34 am

I think some people are hilarious. There's all this talk of city going for Pellegrini and some gormless people (maybe some of you here, I dunno I've not read it all) are saying "yeah great decision top manager".

Would you people (who think mancini is dreadful for winning nothing this year) call Mancini a top manager if he went to Madrid, bought Ronaldo, Alonso, and Benzema but won nothing?

I don't think Pellegrini is a bad manager but I definitely think it's a step backwards to change manager. We didn't show up at all yesterday but I'm so happy that if we lose a final it goes to Wigan. Dave Whelan is a champion of the football world. We had some real good chances yesterday but they should've had 2 penalties and scored the goal that mattered. Fair play to them. I'm not worried, dust ourselves down and try again next year. Let's also note that many managers you rate win nothing on a regular basis. Don't start talking about the money we've spent all over again.

People say it was a masterstroke united buying RVP, it wasn't, it was just OBVIOUS. He is OBVIOUSLY going to score goals and give a team the edge, if our board had of gone after our main targets early enough this season it would've been a really different thing. I give full credit to United and Fergie though, the boy done good. Farewell fergie. Please stay bobby.

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun May 12, 2013 4:14 pm

Poor bobby. I wish him all the best, he helped us achieve what I never though't I'd see. I feel he's suffered as a result of bad management at board room level when it came to changes over the summer and early part of the season. This would've been the first full summer without any changes in the background and would've given them a great chance to build on what's already been done. Of course, I will get behind the team and new manager no questions asked, but I am more disappointed about this than losing the cup final yesterday.

Post by **runcible** » Tue May 14, 2013 12:25 am

What this says is that if Ferguson had been in the same position at the same time in his tenure as Mancini he'd also have been sacked, maybe even earlier. That goes without question. And he'd have actually won less.

The short-sightedness of Premier League football is pure madness. Can they not look at a 4 or 5 year plan? It's not dissimilar to the music biz. I mean look at REM - big sellers over their careers but it took them something like 5 albums to actually 'make it'. In today's rushed climate they'd have been dropped well before that.

This sums up the whole 'football = money' thing I find so distasteful. Man City may have under-achieved this year but they still played some good stuff and may well have taken advantage of Man U's adjustment over the summer. Yet their owners were blind to that.

I have to say I rather liked Mancini too. BOO!

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Tue May 14, 2013 9:18 am

i think a lot of this is self-inflicted by mancini. his confrontational, outspoken manner has only served to isolate him at the club - he's lost the support of the backroom staff &, perhaps more crucially, the dressing room. there are so many personal grievances from the players towards him that come the end it's almost a wonder he was able to field a team willing to play for him.
the only faction he had on his side were the fans. and we know how important they are in the hierarchy of a club.

at the end of the day city have gone backwards this season. he's the fall guy for it even tho the blame should be distributed more evenly.
the errors in last summers transfer market are still the primary reason for them backsliding & in fairness to mancini that was not his doing. they may have cured this w/bringing in the guys from barcelona but even that somehow only served to weaken mancini's position. after he'd complained about those previously working in those roles the club appoint other people he seemingly can't communicate with.

the problem in righting the wrongs of last summer they risk turning next season into a transition year & falling further back - y'know chelsea are gonna back mourinho & united will prob bring in some players for moyes. city surely have to get rid of a host of underperforming players & bring in champions: it's certainly not as a comfortable a position as their rivals looking ahead to the transfer window. they maybe are already playing catch-up.

BUT maybe w/mancini's attitude & ego out of the way perhaps they can steady the ship & start to get the best out of the players they have again.
i actually agree w/James that pellegrini is a step-backwards. mancini's CV is flattered by the serie A titles awarded to Inter after being stripped from Juve (& the millions he's had to spend at both clubs) but that aside he's still won championships which is something i don't think pellegrini has done. re pellegrini's supposed failure at Madrid - harsh when you consider that the barcelona team he was up against was p much the greatest team ever & of course the nefarious internal politics of madrid. he did a decent job there and didn't seem to have any petty altercations w/the big name players.
maybe pellegrini's man-management skills will suit the situation better...
(edit - just checked wiki, pellegrini has won titles in south america..)

i don't think mancini's achievements are so remarkable that it makes him hard to sack or hard to replace. like i say i think his record flatters him somewhat - look how close he was to losing the league only last year ffs.
i actually don't think he'll be a massive loss to city but i do think they maybe could have appointed someone a little more impressive & renown than pellegrini to fill the role & develop the club. i might be wrong tho in my impression of pellgrini, i don't think i'm wrong about mancini.

& i'm sure he'll not be too bothered now he's off to monaco w/a hefty severance. hard to feel much sympathy for the guy all told. i'm sure he'll be fine(!)

Post by **runcible** » Tue May 14, 2013 9:36 am

Interesting points there - I agree with many of them.

The thing you didn't address is the opportunity presented to Man City and Arsenal in terms of Chelsea and Man U having to start afresh with new managers. You can bet the Arsenal board have thought about that - if they get their signings right they may well be in position for a genuine challenge, as would Man City have been. Now you can add a 3rd team to the pile of starting from scratch. Whether Wenger can capitalise on that is one of the most interesting things about next season in my opinion, but Arsenal were so up and down this season - a few brilliant performances where they looked amazing coupled with other completely lacklustre showings.

It's quite something when a somewhat patchy Man U can stroll the league so easily. Credit to them for winning it but this is by some distance NOT the greatest title-winning Man U side.

James T · Post by **James T** » Tue May 14, 2013 11:46 am

Yes, I totally agree it is hard to criticize Pellegrini's reign at Real, and they did say they wouldn't have sacked him if Morinho hadn't become available. He got a records point total to finish in second place. Still, this is the logic a lot of football fans (and owners) seem to favour, DID THEY WIN ANYTHING. Answer: no.

Titles in South America mean absolutely nothing now. They're not recent and the league and style is entirely different. Sure I think he is a good manager, but better than Mancini? No. Even if he does win the league he will of proved nothing, Mancini did that also. I don't think Mancini particularly lost the dressing room, Nasri spoke out in his favour even after the criticism he recieved from him publicly. And in fairness, he has played better since! Tevez has had a fantastic attitude since Mancini dealt with that situation, and he knew when enough was enough with Balotelli. I think the failures this season have been mainly at boardroom level.

I entirely agree about his attitude though. I don't think he means any harm but he is stubborn as they come, and this is not the way to be with mega-bucks owners.

I hear they have also sacked long-standing city staff such as Paul Power and Jim Cassel, something I also totally disagree with. They're keeping Brian Kidd though, what a shame.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Tue May 14, 2013 8:25 pm

well i think part of the idea of bringing pellegrini is is the hope he'll introduce an ethos and culture that the club can be identified with. maybe that's the excuse for removing long-serving staff..
i doubt he'll have the time tho to oversee such a project unless things are both immediately successful & bring plaudits.

i wasn't trying to suggest pellegrini's championship victories are indicative of a special managerial talent - the news of them came as a surprise to me.
but he has produced some fine sides in his time in spain & if he can translate that to city there is potential there for a much more lovable team than the one mancini oversaw. best of luck to him - it'll be interesting whatever happens!

runcible wrote: The thing you didn't address is the opportunity presented to Man City and Arsenal in terms of Chelsea and Man U having to start afresh with new managers. You can bet the Arsenal board have thought about that - if they get their signings right they may well be in position for a genuine challenge, as would Man City have been. Now you can add a 3rd team to the pile of starting from scratch. Whether Wenger can capitalise on that is one of the most interesting things about next season in my opinion, but Arsenal were so up and down this season - a few brilliant performances where they looked amazing coupled with other completely lacklustre showings.

It's quite something when a somewhat patchy Man U can stroll the league so easily. Credit to them for winning it but this is by some distance NOT the greatest title-winning Man U side.

i think the current man u team helps highlight a real dearth of talent in the top tier.
they're not the only team or most guilty, they can only beat what's put in front of them. but the fact they haven't had to be superb champions reflects the poor standard throughout the league.
it's been a poor season - reading & qpr have effectively been relegated from december or so leaving only 1 relegation spot open, that possibly infected the rest of the league w/an attitude that they were already safe & didn't need to push as hard as previous years. the league should be 18 teams.

regarding arsenal, i'm watching them now vs wigan they're playing well so far, look set for champions league qualification.. perversely i think they would benefit from a season out of europe. if they were able to focus all their energy on one competition they wouldn't be so up & down.
i also think at the moment they don't have the quality across the pitch to compete w/the top 3. compare any position on the pitch & chelsea/utd & city prob win every comparison. cazorla & wilshere apart it's hard to think of an arsenal player who'd you'd pick ahead of any of the top 3 counterparts.
even tho the others are facing transition i think they're still too far away to challenge.
i don't trust them in the transfer market - for every cazorla there's a host of dodgy keepers & crap defenders & useless strikers. wenger doesn't seem to be able to build a consistent defensive unit & his midfield has nobody willing to put their foot in, to be the ball winner/watercarrier.
i think they would have to make massive strides over the summer & make at least 3 huge signings to improve not just the squad but the team. & it's hard to see where those signings are going to come from if chelsea & city are in the market which will inflate as a result.
they'll have to take a risk some day if they want to win something. at the minute their ambition still seems to be balancing the books.. they've been linked w/so many players over the past 4/5 years and finally balked/chickened out of signing them until they were forced to panic buy after nasri/cesc & rvp left. it's difficult to have belief they're able to change to a successful strategy after so many years of falling short w/weak decisions.

edit - great goal from maloney. he's been brilliant this year.

James T · Post by **James T** » Tue May 14, 2013 11:59 pm

Carzola is a good player but he hasn't hit the heights he could at arsenal. People go on about how well he has done but I've seen far less that i like about the guy since his move. I guess that says a lot about how good he can be, but I don't worry that he could help take arsenal to the next level. If arsenal put together a top title challenging side I really think he would be a replaceable player. Then again, all of them are replaceable. Nearly so good but nearly so crap...

Post by **runcible** » Wed May 15, 2013 9:04 am

Arsenal did say that for the 5 years after they moved to the Emirates they would be adjusting and settling things financially. It's gone on for longer than that which they didn't expect and that's meant that serious questions are being asked of Wenger, and rightly so. But you can't argue with the way they have run the club, and for that they deserve credit. None of the other top clubs are run like that. But their inconsistency on the pitch has cost them dear. I will stick my neck out and say that their 'invincible' team are the best English side I have ever seen although I may have said that before. They won at Elland Road 4-1 twice in that season (league and cup) and were absolutely breath-taking on both occasions. What's more, after both matches the Leeds fans gave them a standing ovation - that's very, very rare at Elland Road. I was at both games and sat in awe at how good they were - you could see what they were going to do before they did it and yet they were a step ahead so most teams just couldn't stop them.

James T · Post by **James T** » Wed May 15, 2013 11:00 am

Yeah, they took us apart 4 or 5 nil around that period and we all just clapped them and watched some great football cause we never played any back then!

BVCP206 · Post by **BVCP206** » Fri May 17, 2013 12:04 am

runcible wrote:Interesting points there - I agree with many of them.

The thing you didn't address is the opportunity presented to Man City and Arsenal in terms of Chelsea and Man U having to start afresh with new managers. You can bet the Arsenal board have thought about that - if they get their signings right they may well be in position for a genuine challenge, as would Man City have been. Now you can add a 3rd team to the pile of starting from scratch. Whether Wenger can capitalise on that is one of the most interesting things about next season in my opinion, but Arsenal were so up and down this season - a few brilliant performances where they looked amazing coupled with other completely lacklustre showings.

It's quite something when a somewhat patchy Man U can stroll the league so easily. Credit to them for winning it but this is by some distance NOT the greatest title-winning Man U side.

IMHO I think next years title is Chelsea's for the taking if Mourhino takes the job. I thinks Man Utd will certainly find things much more difficult with Moyes at the helm. I really think he is on a hiding to nothing and can only see them going one way

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Sun May 19, 2013 7:26 pm

hugely redundant final day of the season still managed to throw up a bit of entertainment - namely loadsa goals.

both arsenal/spuds seemed to suffer from stage fright/anxiety. spurs had a lot of chances they snatched at, nervous energy in the legs. arsenal were hardly more impressive - walcott again demonstrating why he'll never be a great player at clutch; he had a chance to kill it off in the final minute but missed an easy chance.

tbh i think england's 4 champions league spot would be better used somewhere else.
not especially given to one of the other major leagues of course, i'm not saying the quality of 4th position in italy spain or germany is any better.
it's just it's a lot of reward for not much quality & if you're going to have that level at least give someone else a chance.
if arsenal are just there to make up the numbers let someone else do it for a change.
hopefully tho arsenal do invest in quality this summer. would love to see 4 teams going for the title. love to see a strong epl again.
won't happen tho.

elsewhere the end of an era. scholes is gone. again. the greatest english player ever. bar zizou possibly the best european midfielder of the modern game. i'm gonna miss him. he hasn't been the same player for the past 4-5 yrs really, but when he was at his peak (like 10-12 years) he up there is quality and influence.

i don't like a lot about him but i'll miss fergie too.
& carragher.
anyone else?
steve harper?? saw him crying vs arsenal..

tevez departing english football?
for all the trophies he's won & all his endeavor i can't help feel he never really fulfilled the potential or hype.
maybe it's a symptom of english football you have to sacrifice a level of skill for hardwork or maybe it's just tevez was never that inspirational or creative in the first place?

let the silly season start now!
cavani? falcao? rooney to chelsea? jovetic to arsenal? (if fiorentina dont qualify for champions league??)
bale? surely he's gotta leave spurs now? & i think spurs will go backwards unless AVB stays & buys some goalscorers. liverpool are a coming man & they'll be investing & improving their squad. if spurs backslide liverpool could overtake them again..
& managers. guess lambert is safe at villa but what of pardew? newcastle surely need a french manager!

what about leeds? they've no money but brian mcdermott will surely be looking for some players, will he find the quality? hope they don't sell byram but it'd be impossible to keep him at championship level much longer. best hope would maybe be to sell him & get him back on loan if it does come to pass.. and that'd only happen if a top side came in for him, think he'd walk into most prem teams @ rb.
arsenal should look at him & get rid of sagna.

is beckham lining up the man u job when moyes fails in 6months time? or will fergie be the next utd manager?!

the football's been crap on the pitch but off it it's been great! hope it continues over the summer. am gonna miss it even if it hasn't been a vintage yr. it'll always be remembered now due to fergie leaving & leaving in a dominant position. he's one of life's winners.

James T · Post by **James T** » Mon May 20, 2013 12:27 pm

Tevez came back out for the second half just so they could take him off and he wave goodbye to all the fans yesterday, it seemed that way for sure anyway. I think he did his job for us despite some silly moments. He really helped take us to the next level and his work at the end of last season was great. He has been a fantastic player for us but I think it is time for a reshuffle.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Mon May 20, 2013 1:44 pm

What or who is on the cards for city then?
Is aguero gonna stay also? Another striker coming in?
Would like to see them keep faith w/rodwell, if he has put his injury probs behind him.. Could be exciting nxt season see how he develops. My guess is they'll sign Isco & rodwell will continue to be a squad player..

James T · Post by **James T** » Wed May 22, 2013 11:52 am

Isco seems to be set, and Cavani is looking likely which I'm glad to hear. I'd say Dzeko and Tevez are both leaving but Aguero will stay, that gives them scope to buy 2 or even 3 strikers. I would like to see John Guidetti get his chance when it comes though so 2 out and 2 in up front would work fine.

I think we need maybe another defender and another midfielder too. I can see a lot of people leaving and a lot coming in, but it's unpredictable right now.

Stories which I think have some weight...
Isco, Cavani and Pepe in. I don't really want Pepe but he could probably do a job
Dzeko, Tevez, Kolarov, Sinclair out.

Stories I think are nonsense..
Kompany and Aguero out.

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:26 pm

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 4:22 pm

united were absolutely shocking. i seriously don't even know how much credit you can give city, it was just so easy for them. granted them dominated & wanted to play good football, but united made errors you wouldn't expect from any premiership team & showed the all cohesion of relegation candidates. they were really abysmal & not just because city were so good, but because just were so poor & stupid. 2 good results for city this week after a couple of dodgy outings..

moyes making some bizarre decisions. putting faith in welbeck/ashley young ahead of hernandez/kagawa. his performance in the transfer window was terrible. his treatment of kagawa is bewildering. he doesn't know what to do w/flair players maybe. moyes is struggling badly, he doesn't really know what he's doing - fellaini?! this is the worst man utd midfield probably in my lifetime.

city look to have very little competition this yr. if they don't win it they'll prob only have themselves to blame.
chelsea seem to either be on the verge of boring everyone into submission or fracturing again under mourinho's pettiness, i don't know whether they'll hold it together.

James T · Post by **James T** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 4:50 pm

I think you have to give City a LOT of credit for what was a fantastic result. This was a better result for me than the 6-1 at Old Trafford. 4 past a united team with 11 men for the whole game, never looked in any danger. United did play badly but I can assure you if city weren't on top form United would have found something. That is what united have done for years, play badly and still win. I think Kagawa should have started instead of Young, maybe played Welbeck out wide as he can definitely be a tricky customer on his day!

To say there's no competition is a bit of a stretch also. I know it's early days but Arsenal have started brilliantly, the reason they have missed out challenging in past seasons is because of poor starts and great finishes, if they can have their usual late season form this time round who knows? Chelsea will get it together, but United I don't think much of for this season. Maybe not even next year as there's a lot of age needs replacing in that team now. United will be back at some point though, they won't go away.

Liverpool? Next season will be a strong team, a really strong team.

les revenantes · Post by **les revenantes** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 5:30 pm

I think Moyes is fantastic. He certainly knows what to say : " Rooney is soft " and " RVP is the 1st striker and Rooney is just the backup. " That certainly builds confidence in Wayne Rooney. It is either used to build confidence or to break him down, I believe it is the latter. Rooney won't re-sign w/ United when his contract is up in 2015. I just think that Moyes/Rooney just don't get along going back to their Everton days. Putting Kagawa on the bench is just a bad decision. Moyes is just over his head w/ this position. Someone mentioned Klopp replacing Moyes, but I don't see it. I think he is very comfortable w/ Borussia Dortmund.

James T · Post by **James T** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 5:45 pm

I think Klopp will stay at Dortmund, but I also think if he did leave he would much rather go to somewhere like United or Arsenal than a team like PSG, City or Real.

Moyes out by January, Fergie out of retirement and back in the hot seat.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:17 am

p harsh lesson for city last night

lots of players inadequate if bayern is the level they aspire to.
they need a new keeper first & foremost. then the likes of nasri/clichy/dzeko & honestly a fair few others are not going to be good enough to take them where they want to go. aguero/kompany & silva are really their only top class players, negredo too possibly.
but more so than just signing players/replacements they lack an organic philosophy that takes probably decades to nurture. they can't just buy the kinda performance or class bayern put in for 78mins.

the silver lining being the hash moyes is making across town.
utd have gone badly backwards since ferg left. carrick looks incredibly weak reverting to the spineless performances that he was known for prior to his utd yrs; valencia's a complete moron. cleaverly's a nothing player a disaster waiting to happen. they're in a poor state. giggs is a hundred yrs old & still playing champions league football.
it's hard to see them turning it around. moyes keeps talking out of turn & damaging confidence. if they don't fix it quickly they could be looking at a serious slump. it's hard to see what they could do in january to address the issue.

James T · Post by **James T** » Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:56 am

I'm on holiday so I won't post a long one, but I don't want people to think I only crop up on this thread when we win!

Yesterday was a tough one, but remember how they dismantled Barca last year... We just about did a better job than they managed. If silva's free kick had've gone in a 3-2 scoreline isn't bad against the best team in the world regardless of the performance. And if Boateng hadn't of been his usual can't-catch-up-so-take-the-red self, there's every chance yaya would've scored again without that free kick. I would have started with milner ahead of navas yesterday as we really needed that workhorse style against that team. Nasri is a world-class player but was totally useless yesterday.

I am starting to think Joe Hart IS indeed the biggest fraud in modern day football, but I hope not. He was so great but something has gone wrong here. Let's hope something changes again and he's back to his best form soon. Yesterday all 3 goals could be blamed on him (but also one on fernandinho), and the only other clear chance they got was offside but not given as offside (thankfully no goal). Had he of performed we could easily have got an undeserved point against the worlds best side right now.

I don't want to comment on moyes much, never rated him especially but he needs time before any informed comments are made in regards to his job at old trafford.

James T · Post by **James T** » Thu Oct 24, 2013 1:32 pm

Nice to see Joe Hart get back to some of his old best last night, a massive save in the dying seconds of that game which looks like it will put us through to the knockout rounds. If we beat moscow at home, we might not even need a point from our last 2 games (one of which is Plzen at home anyway) Bayern away might be a fight for top spot, but I expect they will secure that before then anyway... Even if just on goal difference, we would have to win maybe 5 or 6 nil.

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:48 pm

Costel Pantilimon - IN

Joe Hart - OUT NOW before they slide further down the table.

James T · Post by **James T** » Tue Oct 29, 2013 12:30 pm

It's certainly a strange one isn't it? I just can't understand what's going on with Hart, some absolutely shocking stuff the past 6 months. Clichy was also abysmal in the Chelsea game, Kolarov has actually done well this season so maybe he should have an extended run (very dangerous going forward also)..

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:50 am

he's overconfident
he's stupid
technically he's been found wanting on a number of occasions
i'm sure he's a great professional in training & for the club but he doesn't perform very well on matchday
it's good for him it's the mickey mouse cup this weekend gives him an excuse of missing the game.

he's been protected for yrs by the british media desperate for an english goalkeeper. it prob doesn't hurt he's white w/blonde hair.

the best english goalkeeper is playing for celtic. but nobody cares cause it's scotland & even tho he's playing champions league football nobody seems to notice anyway.

always liked kolorov
never understood the signing of clichy. maybe something to do w/passports/eu squad places or something? am sure city had another decent left back around that time..

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:00 am

Pantilimon has proved himself today. Sorry, Joe Hart, I always thought you were a bit overrated.

James T · Post by **James T** » Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:00 pm

Clichy has been much better than Kolarov until this season, and has been really consistent. I think for the price he was a great signing but needs a break now, kinda like joe hart I guess.

Pantillimon proved absolutely nothing against Norwich, but did well against Newcastle like you said. I think he is a good back-up but Joe Hart has been a fantastic keeper in previous years and I hope he will get back to it. He got way too into himself and that is an issue, has become a right fraud.

7-0 should shut a few people up, but we still need to improve away form.

CSKA tonight, if we win we progress to the next round of CL. Even a draw makes it look pretty certain considering we have to play Plzen next, with CSKA playing Bayern in that week.

James T · Post by **James T** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:51 am

Another 5 goals, impressive against a side like CSKA who are pretty tough on their day with some good attacking players.

Honda, Tosic and Doumbia caused us some problems, Clichy once again having a shocker of a game. Pantillimon made me nervous on a couple of occasions but the only real mistake was when he came out for that cross and did absolutely nothing once he got to it. I guess he's allowed his nervy moments in a champions league debut after 2 years on the bench.

Aguero was insane last night, and Nasri has also been amazing the past month. When those 2 are on form, with Silva making it tick and Negredo there in the box, we are unplayable. Then you have Fernandinho winning the ball back with ease and then setting us on our way through Yaya again, really good to watch.

Defense is shocking though, need Kompany back quickly. Maybe start playing Kolarov ahead of Clichy despite the fact he is not too great at the defense side of being a wing back.... Very dangerous forward.

Looking forward to what's to come.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:09 pm

move for casillas

aguero has been superb this term. i've always loved watching him but he's finally hitting the consistency to go along w/his talent. he should be one of the best in the world.

the defensive vulnerability does make it interesting tho. should be walting the league were it not for the dodgy carryon at the back.

don't know how much credit you can take for beating that norwich team 7-0 @ home.

James T · Post by **James T** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 4:59 pm

Signing an other keeper I think is a stupid idea, people talk about English players not developing but then call for them to sign a new player when one of the top performers of the last 3/4 seasons has a dip in form. I have give him some stick cause this year e has been taking the piss and not really giving a shit. He just needs a kick up the arse.

jack white · Post by **jack white** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:16 pm

yea but it's not city's responsibility to produce players for england*. they've got to look after their own interests & hart's a liability as far as those interests are concerned.
& it is different a keeper having a dip in form than an outfield player. an outfield player makes an error there's another line of defence capable of preventing a goal, a keeper makes an error it's going to be costly..

i actually think this could be the making of hart.
i've always thought he was overly arrogant & suspect technically & instead of scrutinising him he got a free pass from england fans & the press & it all contributed to hindering his progress.
now tho he has something to prove & it should improve him if his attitude really is correct.
i mean he obviously is talented but he is suspect in his decision making & regards some of his shot stopping (he seems to have a habit of blocking the ball w/his wrist/forearm rather than his hands or fingers it really infuriates me no end).

*it is tho in city's interests to produce their own homegrown players, simply due to uefa regulations for squads competing in euro comps. this can be easily worked around & usually is but to the detriment of squad size in those comps. but techincally those homegrown players don't necessarily have to be english just have trained at the club from a certain age i think..

& seriously, if the chance came to sign casillas you wouldn't take it? the guy has won the world cup, 2 euro championships & 2 champions leagues.
hart's got one premiership title to his name - a title which again doesn't withstand much scrutiny being as it was a rather soft league which was bizarrely only won w/the last kick of the last game by a team which bought the title......

James T · Post by **James T** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 10:36 pm

Casillas has struggled to get in the Madrid team for a while now, and it has continued past Mourinho's stint in charge, He had a great game yesterday mind you, but so did Joe Hart in almost every champions league game he has played. I would rather stick by hart than sign someone new, it's too early to make the call to go out and get someone new.

"Bought the title"

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:24 pm

Yeah, I thought of Iker Casillas to City and certainly it would be a lot easier to lure him w/ David Silva and Jesus Navas on the squad, but I think he'll either stay in Madrid or one of the clubs in the La Liga. Don't know too much about Pantillimon and have never seen him play, but anything is better than Hart at goalkeeper. Maybe, he'll come to form after sitting on the bench for a few matches.

I, guess it's nice to have a club with so many superstars that you can release them and in this case for free. My God, Ozul to Arsenal on a free transfer - what was Real thinking ? Certainly tipped Arsenal in right direction and David Villa to Athletico Madrid ( who are now to be reckoned with ).

Shinesalight · Post by **Shinesalight** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:29 pm

spacemanrich wrote:My God, Ozul to Arsenal on a free transfer - what was Real thinking ?

Eh, I was under the impression that Arsenal paid Real just over £42 million for him?

Post by **runcible** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:23 pm

Shinesalight wrote:
spacemanrich wrote:My God, Ozul to Arsenal on a free transfer - what was Real thinking ?
Eh, I was under the impression that Arsenal paid Real just over £42 million for him?

Yeah me too! Broke their transfer record by some distance!

James T · Post by **James T** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 7:37 pm

Only manchester city buy players I'll have you know.

Shinesalight · Post by **Shinesalight** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 8:18 pm

James T wrote:Only manchester city buy players I'll have you know.

No, James, Man City buy titles not players

Post by **runcible** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:38 pm

Shinesalight wrote:
James T wrote:Only manchester city buy players I'll have you know.
No, James, Man City buy titles not players

spacemanrich · Post by **spacemanrich** » Fri Nov 08, 2013 12:56 am

My mistake, your right about Ozul. In fact, he is the highest German transfer player to date. I don't know who I was thinking of, it'll come to me ... or not ?

James T · Post by **James T** » Fri Nov 08, 2013 1:01 pm

Flamini went to Arsenal on a free, which in my opinion was a fairly good deal for both sides and has works out well so far.

"Titles", I wish it was plural but unfortunately not. At least the guys who own us do a lot for manchester on the whole. They sure as hell have done more for east Manchester than this government ever have. Of course every team would prefer to work their way up and become a force without spunking so much money around, but you'd be hard pressed to find a fan who wouldn't want their team to spend big if they had the opportunity provided. And in terms of Arsenal... I'm sure man city could gather some money together if we charged over £1000 for a season ticket instead of our lowest being just £300. Southampton have blown massive money in comparison to what their income must be, spending over 70 million the past 2 summer windows with smaller crowds, smaller sponsorship, smaller tv revenue, smaller commercial appeal. For the record though, I have a soft spot for southampton since I went down there as a boy and got so worried every time james beattie had the ball. Fortunately we had Paulo Wanchope available to win us the game.

James T · Post by **James T** » Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:51 pm

Really poor result at Sunderland today. We can go on and on about the non-red card for larsson but you have to win that game when rivals drop points. I wanted united to win though, even if it is a shame they went above us for now (for now?)...

Really worried about the defence. Pantillimon? Poor effort with that shot. Try not to be too hard on the guy, but if every judges him the same way they have with hart.... I did give hart some bad stick at one point earlier this season, but I would rather have him than Pantillimon in net particularly with a makeshift defence fielded. When I saw that line-up today, well I knew what was about to happen.

Navas ain't doing it. Garbage (so far)...