Attack on French Satirical Paper by Islamist Terrorists

[semisynthetic]

The Hillary video is important to point out to this POTUS, that if you don't know your enemy, if your understanding is based ONLY on what you WISH TO BELIEVE, then what measures you take or do not take, or what involvent you make based on faulty assumptions can have the ever waiting Unintended Consequences. The USA involves itself with all types of peoples; it is a zoo of a world; but unfortunately, in an attempt to use surrogates to fight the former CCCP, we involved ourselves with some very nasty people to whom life means very little. These short term fixes come back to burn us all too often.

Whereas the French President Hollande, still stinging from a terrible attack on his country, says "we must be very clear (about the situation); we are at war with Islamic Terrorism" I obviously paraphrased but the point is there - one President is very clear about who attacked them and who they are fighting, while the POTUS still does a bizarre dance as to avoid saying "Islamic Terrorist"; it is bizarre and unclear; if we do not focus on who the enemy is, who exactly wishes us harm, it makes the POTUS and the USA look far more out of touch than our Military Planners are in fact; it makes the President look weak and indecisive; the Office of the Presidency is by nature beset by problems that no one could expect; but just because the World Events DO NOT "fit" with his State of the Union agenda and Ideology, it is not the time to ignore what is going on and who is involved. A true leader would adapt to these ever-changing events that affect The USA and the World. Over the last few years, we see a pattern of a man who believes himself to never being wrong, blaming mistakes on others, and other
constants that are too sickening for me to even list. I remain optimistic; transfer of power in the USA is a smooth process, but 2016 is looking further and further away. I hope that the new Senate, along with the House, will make themselves more relevant; Mr. Reid, while the Senate Leader stopped hundreds of votes from ever happening; the saddest part is the number of useful and positive bills that were bipartisan, but did not "fit the agenda", and were never voted on.
Meanwhile, the POTUS is focused on methane and a list of "free" goodies that the youth of this country more than anyone in the coming years will be saddled with paying for. I am saddened for the youth of this country, you live in an age that you are supposed to benefit from, but I fear you will have less while paying for these mad mistakes and Social Experimentation.

[BzaInSpace]

double standards all over the shop when muslim countries, take Palestine for example, cannot say the same (and get away with it) to the west as the mayors and presidents around Europe (belgium, rotterdam etc) says of theirs: “ if you don’t like freedom , pack your bags and f off”.

also kinda scary to think this outpouring of rage toward the Islamic world will surely incite more hyper violence between “us and them"...

Nailed it.

I differ in your reading that Hypocrisy is a speciality of Islamic countries. The west is pretty hot on it too and has / does support many of those same dictatorships - I imagine the Saudi's will probably continue to fund ISIS, I wonder if the US will also? ISIS seem to be the same group US and UK were so keen to arm to topple Assad only a year or so ago. It seemed like such a good idea at the time.

Yep.

I have seen and read reports over the years that these "no go zones" are quite real and far more easily demonstrated in France. As I understand it, these "zones" are much newer in the UK, and far smaller and less numerous.

Yeah, Fox News and American media in general are really authoritative on the subject. They probably know all about The Black Country too.

Pfft, This thread has infuriated and fascinated me for some time. There's a mass of bullshit being represented as truth, the Fox news report on Birmingstan says it all.

I actually feel bad for Stuart X. Hunter who dared question the "official narrative" - why shouldn't he? This isn't the fucking Fox network or linked to (god forbid) the BBC. Despite the 17 deaths in France, are we to accept everything we are told via the news? Surely we are all grown-up to realize that all official news channels operate from a position of interest and particular agendas?

I may not agree with whatever Stuart was trying to say before he was circle-jerked out of this thread, but surely his opinion should at least be considered? How ironic in a thread concerned with free speech...

As to what Stuart asked - who might benefit from this? Bizarrely enough, Russell Brand might have an idea. The old idea that it "was a good day to bury bad news" may well apply to a certain unpleasant individual and his billlionaire paedophile pal...

This stuff about France being the US's oldest ally and that is totally ridiculous - it wasn't so long ago the likes of "Freedom Fries" and "Cheese Eating Surrender Monkeys" was accepted notions, and the sadistic Donald Rumsfeld's comment that France was part of "Old Europe" due to the French deciding not to join the Axis Of Freedom's bloodthirsty and futile crusade. Now all of a sudden "We're all Charlie"?

Doublethink on the go I feel. That's another reference to Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four too, by the way.

Lastly, the kudos being given to the Charlie Hebdo magazine is just weird. Personally, proper satire should be dealt with at least with an ounce of intelligence. Those crappy cartoons are the equivalent of drawing pictures of dicks in the Koran. Nobody deserved to die from that bullshit - but please let's not pretend they were somehow emblematic of a just a fair society. The double standards at work in the media is fucking insaner still...

Chris Morris' Four Lions would be the recommendation for many of those posting here to be honest.

Whoever linked to the Power Of Nightmares docs was onto something too I think...

[plastic37]

My only further contribution is an unfinished twitter joke about the curried halal swan delicacy my neighbour brought round a few nights ago.

[semisynthetic]

I would likely not be a Charlie Hebdo reader; the cartoons and type of satire are not my taste; but there should be no bully boy tactics to eliminate the idea of Free Speech. I hold the ability to annoy and poke fun at anything in a free society as fair game; I did want Stuart to present his analysis, but taking the core truths of who was killed and why, I wanted to read an analysis using facts; I believe the video was not helpful to his analysis; however, I have read or heard several "explanations" that mainly focused on keeping the "gaff of the day from Washington" (and other Capitols) off the front burner by the media; but each example (in the USA) seemed purely political; the examples of other Capitols were not something I was familiar with at all, so my "opinion" would not be very informed. Otherwise, it looks like a very Extreme, bloody act, with a group that took credit for it.

Defining WHAT "proper satire" SHOULD BE is not in the spirit of what for me is a view held by The 1st Amendment. As for me, I found the "crucifix in urine" to be in bad taste; but killing someone for it never entered my mind.

If you would look at the first Post, I simply tried to convey the best information available at the time; it was never meant as a hate thread or any more than just presenting the data at that time of who did what, who was affected, and would the Satirical Magazine cave in to these attacks.

[Mustard]

I'll come back into this briefly as I was quick to comment on the film Stuart posted calling it 'inappropriate'. Of course, it wasn't inappropriate really but a pretty poor representation and critic of the reporting and events surrounding what happened to Lee Rigby and the French killings. The suggestion that it was actors etc is just laughable but also equally concerning.

Look, I'm as up for a conspiracy as the best of you. I don't 'believe' a lot of reporting from the media but if the response to the media from the Rigby fliming was the the govt and media was tailoring the film for propaganda purposes, I'd have agreed but suggesting that it was a set-up with actors playing roles deserves the slating. The film actually makes a couple of decent points before descending into farce. If there is a genuine belief in that film then come back and sell it again. I wouldn't waste my time watching it again though but I'd be interested in better examples.

I also wouldn't buy the CH magazine. I really rated the Four Lions film. I also had to defend the watching of the film to someone who thought it glorified the bombers. I mean, really.

Apologies, Stuart, no intention to hound you.

[KingHarry]

High fives to this guy for pointing out the hiprocrisy -

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/01 ... 1421144526

Also, have you seen the picture of all these leaders apparently 'standing in solidarity' with the marchers, but actually all by themselves? Tells quite a story.

On a side note, people in the UK with iplayer may might this worth watching - http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/adamcurtis

Adam Curtis did a 5-minute piece in the middle of Charlie Brooker's end of Year Screenwipe. Theory being that political control is now enhanced by wilfully confusing the populace with ever more contradictory and ridiculous news.
If not seen, it's very worth watching.
I love his stuff

Yes I saw that and I could see the truth in it. I'm going to hunt down some more of his films on u tube at some point.

Adam Curtis' BitterLake doc now up on BBC IPlayer.
It's actually > 2 hours long.
And, as ever, it's just astonishing.

And very sad.

As with all his work - however profound the content is, the visuals and soundtrack are brilliantly executed. He likes his Burial and NIN. Plus some nice moments of Bowie - including Bewlay Brothers.

[clewsr]

We are watching it in bite size chunks. saw the first forty minutes the other night.

I had no idea about the deal done with the Saudis. I've always been confused about the strange relationship between US/ UK and Saudi but now it a makes much more sense.

[KingHarry]

We are watching it in bite size chunks. saw the first forty minutes the other night.

I had no idea about the deal done with the Saudis. I've always been confused about the strange relationship between US/ UK and Saudi but now it a makes much more sense.

Sound plan. I did it in 2 sittings, but things move quickly and you need to give it attention, so multiple chunks makes sense. I love the way he weaves the innocuous footage of Afghan people just living their lives into the historic narrative of the formation of modern Afghanistan. He nails the way that we have been encouraged to digest everything in the simple terms of Good v Evil and endless drivel of the threat to our 'Freedom'.

As in initial post though - I just find his work so visually interesting and his choice of soundtrack is always perfect. Jonathan Meades is another who welds high-brow / challenging narrative with a production team that have a pretty enviable collection of vinyl.

[Mustard]

Last paragraph of Semi's post on the jan'12 sums it up

[Hedspace]

Bitter Lake up on youtube for those outside the uk. mesmerizing film making

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UM8W87UcO2U

If theres synch issues with youtube, which will most certainly detract from the viewing, try using Hola vpn proxy which removes region blocks. You can view bbc iplayer with that installed. fairly straightforward.

hola chrome extension
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/deta ... meio?hl=en

install > click on the hola icon: top right of browser > choose country you want to be seen as > navigate to bbc iplayer and you should be good to go.
The iplayer stream is HD and the doc is best viewed via your TV with a bottle or 2 of wine.


make what you will of this >
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJEvlKK ... 1422801025

[clewsr]

http://rt.com/op-edge/228295-bitter-lake-dangerous-tv/

[Hedspace]

not sure if I should view the RT link ^ ....wasnt that site recently viewed as a terrorist threat by the new Chief of the US Broadcasting Board of Governors

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/22/us/br ... .html?_r=0

[clewsr]

The Great Dinosaur Conspiracy

Now you know I like a good conspiracy as much as the next crazed loon, so it really is quite refreshing when I see something so utterly bat shit crazy that it makes me feel sane.

And before you think this is just a beautiful, wonderfully crafted troll post, there seems to be a 3000+ facebook group to back it up.Oh my.

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/mumsnet_cla ... 2Bchildren

[semisynthetic]

clewsr, you must be absolutely MAD. Conspiracy indeed; PURE FICTION!

Just view this clearly Fresh Fish from my - REFRIGERATOR, but not my collection. As fresh as it has been for.......awhile; not even any of that tell-tale "fishy" odor that gives "old, NOT FRESH fish" away! "DINO SORES" and such stuff is pure fiction; fed to the weak minded who read too many books without pictures or conversations.



"and what is the use of a book, thought Alice, without pictures or conversations?.......

[semisynthetic]

And now to be serious. The Topic has certainly evolved. Sadly, I am not surprised 3000 people on some social media peddle this stuff; there are many more who will never use social media for any number of reasons who believe that Darwin is Evil and Evolution is a term to be avoided.

Over the years, I have had some of the kindest, sweetest, smartest people; so Instilled with WHAT to think, but not HOW to think", they follow what they've been told at home, even while trying to cooperate in an advanced class. Oftentimes it is Dinosaurs vs An Extreme AntiScience "Phobia", but this domination lasts for years and years; however, this poor beaten soul is sometimes, when care and consideration is given, a real, unique, and NEW, truly independent person emerges. I wrote about one such person but I decided it might be too long.

Can you imagine how difficult it is to deal with these extreme Phobias that otherwise very intelligent, yet very young (generally) and certainly long-dominated individuals, in a classroom, where I might discuss the "evolution of a tryptan nucleus yields"....and they are torn inside - physically sickened; because of that one word - evolution - and I simply referred to a change over time in Research! No Darwinian theory need be invoked; just Years of some sick dominating parent. I had one nutty Mommy physically remove her grown kid from my class (the LAST and Highest level before Graduate School), calling everyone (the students, me, the goldfish) "FRANKENSTEINS!" In 35 years, I knew 4 such people, so cruelly dominated by a seemingly confused parent, that the kid had a very rough time; and they could not have made it into that class by accident; it was not easy to even get in, so they obviously wanted to learn past a level that "homelife" would allow; but a lifetime of "training" had doubtless made this extremely difficult; it would likely drive some people mad.

Maybe I should've posted the story; a true and specific event that changed someone's outlook for the better, and O is now helping children with learning disorders; a perfect example of a wonderful, intelligent and kind person who when confronted with specific points, broke free from that tight, cruel hold. Not someone in this class, but still a lucky one.