Banning of a forumite

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NightWash
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Banning of a forumite

Post by NightWash » Mon Mar 20, 2017 10:28 pm

Hi,

i accidentially deleted the topic when i wanted to clean up the move of the thread (it existed in 2 forum - Music and here, where it belongs).

The action was not meant to stop this discussion, we are open to your comments.

Again sorry for the deletion.

N

sunray
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by sunray » Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:45 am

I'll go again then.
Wasn't aware of any ban but i'm assuming it was semisynthetic that got the boot? Can't say I read everything he posted but what I did read didn't offend me in the slightest. I may not share his views but I wouldn't see that as a legitimate reason for kicking him off the forum.
Unless he was sending abusive pm's I think there's been a complete overreaction.
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Aquarian-Time » Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:27 am

Totally agree with sunray, I don't agree with everything he says politically but hey ho, his views are still valid. Its a a forum, we discuss things, we are not robots.
Based on this banning, I will take my leave until you see fit to re-instate him to the board.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by runcible » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:30 pm

Although I understand the protestations about free speech I find the forum to be like a bar that now sells beer I don't like.

So the easiest thing is for me to split. I will leave you guys to it. Someone will need to take over the reins as this board is not paid for by any management etc. but by me and has been since we switched servers. And it's hardly good value as far as I am concerned. Seems bizarre that one contributor can have such an effect but people left the forum for that reason. And I am joining them. See ya...

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by mojo filters » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:39 pm

Initially I found those superior-toned emboldened posts incredibly off putting. Then I realised they offered an easy visual clue, allowing me to skip past and down to something readable - the closest thing we have to any proper "ignore" function.

I dare say in amongst the insufferable smugness, there may have been something worth reading, but I wasn't prepared to fight my way through dense and rambling long passages in the hope of finding such.

If he couched his views in a more user-friendly language and format, I might know what they are. If he didn't consistently approach everything from such a presumptuous self-aggrandising point of view, I might actually care what heinous act has caused this situation.

I am curious why everyone else is all worked up. What did I miss?
No one ever says "Robert Mueller - that guy just shoots from the hip!"
No one ever says "Robert Mueller - what an erratic fellow!"
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by spzretent » Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:52 pm

From a moderator's perspective.
Things like this are not taken lightly whatever you guys think and it is a democracy so majority rules.
This is not the first time the banned party has been reprimanded. He has also been sent several pm's asking him to change the way he posts ie: color and use of bold and caps. This issue was a few years ago. You guys may not care but others on here do.
We get emails, pm's and complaints in person. Every time I travel to see a Spiritualized show I am asked about this member. Never fails.
We have had several forum members leave because not everyone has as thick a skin on here as others do. We have had long time forum members leave recently as well. Now we have a moderator threatening to leave. I think this is where a line was drawn.
During this last flare up in the Donald vs Hilary thread it boiled over. It wasn't his arguments as much as the way he responded which upset many. Either thru pm or actual post. Also getting personal with a few people taking what was sent in a pm and using it on the board. It is called a "private message" for that very reason.
While I am at it I think many of you should know that about 5 years ago we nearly lost the "official" link to Spiritualized. Why? Because, this being the internet, people think they can say whatever they want behind the anonymity of keyboard. Well people involved with the band then read the board regularly and were amazed at the vitriol posted on here about a 5 second clip of a new song being "shit" and artwork being "shit". Would you actually say this to Jason's face? If not probably think twice before posting it here. They just emailed us and said that's it. Why would we want to endorse this level of nastiness. Were it not for a well crafted from the heart email from BzaInSpace to Jason's then manager that would have been the end of their endorsement of this forum. That endorsement is very important for several reasons.
In truth we don't do that much moderating. There really is no need. Much of the things we do you guys never hear about. Like moving the board from a German based server to a UK based server so we can continue links to live shows and not fear reprisal from the German government. It is illegal there and monitored. This is something Jason sees as crucial to the forum.
So everyone needs to chill out here. Us moderators are in constant contact with each other and when we feel things have cooled down we will reconsider. Until then you guys do what you think you have to do.
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Aquarian-Time » Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:02 pm

Thanks for that well written retort, I for one didn't realise quite the problems/issues etc said forum member had caused over the years, obviously if things get personal then a line needs to be drawn and quickly.

This forum has brought together some fine people, via the world wide only or in person and that i will e forever grateful.

And with that, I return to the folds... :D

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Laz69 » Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:54 pm

Jeeez... you don't pop in for a visit for a day or so and all hell breaks loose!

I'm all for debate and discussion BUT fundamental breaking of privacy rules SHOULD be treated accordingly. I know i've had PMs with said member in the past and, although nothing particularly important, i would expect them to stay exactly that... private.

I sincerely hope Mark L doesn't disappear as i've found his knowledge and musical suggestions invaluable for probably over a decade now and someone who i would consider a friend.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by olan » Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:16 pm

I am sorry that we've had to go as far as banning somebody as this is a very tranquil and supportive corner of the www. I'm of the opinion that discussions about banned members are probably a poor idea as the individual or individuals in question have no right of reply.

Also, for what it is worth, I don't think this place will really offer as much without Mark. I do hope he reconsiders as I think his input here is always very valuable. Also, he is older than me, which is increasingly less common these days....

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by ro » Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:26 pm

Aquarian-Time wrote:This forum has brought together some fine people, via the world wide only or in person and that i will e forever grateful.
Agreed.
Thank you, Mods, for all your hard work and devotion.
Runcible, please reconsider. You are an anchor here.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by ro » Tue Mar 21, 2017 6:01 pm

runcible wrote:...this board is not paid for by any management etc. but by me and has been since we switched servers
I had no idea. Thank you for doing that. Mark, I very much hope you stick around, but I can certainly understand not wanting to pay for beer you dislike.
If the site continues to be fan-run, shall we take up a collection? Go co-operative? I'd be glad to donate a little bit each month to help maintain my favorite place on the internet.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by heisenberg » Tue Mar 21, 2017 6:25 pm

I'd like to say to Runcible, the rest of the mods and all the regulars that we have a great little community here that is rich and vibrant in so many ways. It would be a terrible shame to lose any of the key members of the board and slowly lose such a great community over one ugly incident that is ultimately not representative of the forum as a whole.

I sincerely appreciate all the work that the mods do (and up until now I have mostly been oblivious to just how much work that is-that story from five years ago was hard to read!). I am so grateful for the kindness and generosity of the average poster here, who just wants to share and chat about the music they love. I've benefitted so much from the indispensible musical recommendations of people on this board, not to mention the numerous links to shows and CDs I've received from members over the years. The kindness and support of the good people here knows no bounds. Just last week several board members were kindly offering me to help me make a poster. I've even collaborated musically with one great member of this board. The positives far outweigh the negatives and I think we should all fight to keep this board a happy place to be. Plus we've got a new Spiritualized album hopefully coming soon, things can only improve and become more exciting around these parts. We need all the key players here to discuss the new album when it comes.

Sorry if this comes across as cheesy, but I think the important people here need to know just how valued their contribution is. Please don't feel pushed out of something that was once so valuable to you. You have the backing of a lot of people who want the board to return to being something to be proud and excited about. There's enough brilliant people to make that happen again.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by sunray » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:19 pm

Agree with all the recent posts of support and good vibes for this place.

Thanks for the reponse from Spzretent for shedding some light on things, I remember the colour,caps,bold situation from a few years back alright.
While I cannot get my head around people leaving, as olan put it, this "tranquil and supportive corner of the www", because of one person, it unfortunately appears to be the reality.
It is a shame about Runcible, I hope he reconsiders, as he will be sorely missed.

I would certainly be prepared to pay some donation to keep this place going as it's my number 1 go to place on the net and I would be fairly bored without it. Facebook and other forums just don't do it for me.
I'm losing my edge, but I was there...

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by niamhm » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:51 pm

This issue seems to have developed into a bit of a crisis for the board which is a shame, but certain subjects always have a potential to get a little out of hand, politics and religion I find from my own experience, online reaction to the sudden passing of Martin McGuiness today being perfect example and the thread at the centre of this certainly got a little testy and saw emotions running high and that`s understandable in the current climate.

As far as banning goes I wasn`t aware it had happened until this thread appeared and I think it's a sanction that should be reserved for hate speech, threats of violence, extreme personal abuse or persistent trolling and I`m not sure any of those lines were crossed, just my opinion.

It`s a sad day if Runcible feels he has go, I don`t know how much you guys/gals do behind the scenes but it`s appreciated here for sure and Spzretents little reminder of when the forum was down brings that into a sharper focus, this is the one forum I return to everyday, sometimes a few times a day even if I don`t post for a while I always look in here daily, hopefully Mark will reconsider after a little time out.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by James T » Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:02 pm

I had to stop talking football before I got banned...

In seriousness though, it is sad it has come to this. I've met some of my best friends through this forum. Hopefully everyone deserting us will return and we can get our act together.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by spzretent » Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:38 pm

Many of us have met some great people thru this site. Some, as James T mentioned, I consider some of my closest friends. I have been put up in forum members homes and met many others either before of after Spiritualized shows. It is a pretty long list.
That will not stop.
I guess every once in a while things boil over and it makes you take step back and realize what a special community this really is.
I never go any further than this forum for band recommendations. That says a lot since I am still obsessed with music. You should see some of the late night threads on Whats App I have had with a UK forum member battling it out over which Psychic Ills record is better or which Husker Du album is the best. It is 100% passion. Pure and simple.
I haven't found this anywhere else on the www. Not that I have really looked.
I am kind of happy that Donald vs Hilary thread is locked. So much has happened even in the last week I feel like my head is going to explode. I definitely would have popped off in that thread. This is a terrible time for many of us in the US.
Hopefully things will cool down a bit. Both on the board and politically.
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by toomilk » Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:30 am

Yes, Runcible, please reconsider. This once was an infinite well of musical knowledge and lively discussions, but I feel like in the past couple years it's been a little stagnant. However, I don't think this is the end. Semi was always nice to me, but he did often create hostile threads that was very off-putting.

In the overplayed, toxic (yet meaningless) words of some jerk-off: "MAKE THE SPIRITUALIZED FORUM GREAT AGAIN!"


Mark - if there's any way I can contribute to your costs, please let me know. I'm willing to chip in to keep this great place afloat.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by BzaInSpace » Wed Mar 22, 2017 12:48 pm

Mark Runcible has been moderating here since the very beginning, that's probably near 20 years now. I also consider him a very close friend, so it's depressing (at the very least) to read that he's calling it quits.

I too hope he reconsiders.

Thanks also to all who've offered support one way or another. Probably some kind of community-based payment thing is how this needs to operate down the line. We'll be in touch regarding this soon...

It's reassuring to read the positive feedback on why this place is so important - so many have said it better than me, and I'll only add my agreement. However in recent times this place has felt toxic and very unwelcoming - it's easy to say "just ignore it" but some of us have the (at times) thankless task of reviewing everything that is written.

And when you have people from all around the world commenting on a particular posters' 'methods' - see what Alan said - and the distinctly negative attributes associated the above then it's pretty much a damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't situation.

Nothing like banning someone is every taken lightly, and I'd be lying if it hasn't weighed a lot on my mind recently.

However: this is a forum based around a psychedelic rock & roll band - we could leave the place wide open for any kind of comment but you've got places like reddit for that. Or just see the seething mass of armchair warriors at work in every MSM news outlet that allows comment, and realise this place is way better than that.

The music usually speaks for itself - and certainly deserves better - than just ever-increasing levels of bizarre, inflammatory and personal comment.
toomilk wrote:
In the overplayed, toxic (yet meaningless) words of some jerk-off: "MAKE THE SPIRITUALIZED FORUM GREAT AGAIN!"
:lol:
O P 8

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by natty » Wed Mar 22, 2017 12:59 pm

Don't post here much these days, don't have the time with two small kids, although I still lurk a bit, but this is all rather sad to read, especially to see the Mark leaving the forum. He'll be a great loss to this place. This has been one of the best, friendliest forums I've ever posted on, with the most knowledgeable people when it comes to music, and on the whole, free of internet dickheads and trolls.

Perhaps it would be worth considering a "no politics" rule, or you could perhaps kill two birds with one stone, by having a subscription (to raise money for the server) which gives members access to an "exclusive" forum with less moderation where people can discuss such things - and others - if they so wish, or maybe make the "other" forum subscription only? Would also be pretty easy to put a Paypal link in the top corner of the top banner or something, where people could donate to keep it going.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by sm-iom » Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:30 pm

I'd rather see a 'no politics' approach as well. I'm here for the fantastic discussions on music - releases, recommendations, vinyl set-ups, gigs etc. I don't see where or why politics (or even football 8)) fit in...

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by MODLAB » Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:52 pm

I'll make it short.


Most has been said already. It was a tough decision and it took many many years of
many people being harassed.


I've been here for 11 years met some great people and hope he will reconsider too.


As for political posts – all we ask is to respect people. 'A VERY SIMPLE RULE'.



All the best,

Mark
Design.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by simonkeeping » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:03 pm

Whoa :shock:


I just want to share some of the sentiments of spzretent - Please forgive me, Its a long rambling story but it does have a point. About 14 years ago I was in serious financial problems and subsequently couldn't afford to buy music so I came up with the idea of sharing compilations on here. Everyone got involved, it was great! Every few days a new one would drop through the letterbox - a CDR with someones personally crafted playlist on. It was a very nice community thing and it bought a warm glow to know people out there had gone to the trouble of putting something together for no other reward other than they just wanted to share music with like minded people.

Last week I was sat in the park on the way back from the doctors and no word of a lie I put on some tracks from Runcibles comp which has travelled digitally across numerous hard drives, iphones and ipods. It was a nice experience to sit there listen to the music and think about this place. All the bands I've been turned on to, all the shows I've seen, All the genuinely lovely people I've met and subsequently friends I've made through coming on here. It's what made me keep coming back in the first place. Mark Runcible I hope you don't leave here. I really do.
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by TheWarmth » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:53 pm

I think if we all make an effort, we can revive the forum. I'm willing to do what I can, even if that simply means being more involved and posting more frequently. I hope Mark L. and others who might be thinking about leaving reconsider and decide to stay. I've been a member for something close to 15 years and I have no intention of going away.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by BROKENHEART » Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:35 pm

Would just like to say that this forum has been a big part of my life since I joined a few years back. Musically, introduced to new bands and concerts that I would never have heard of, and so much up to date information and topic conversations .
I visit at least a couple of times a day and look forward to doing so . It would be a great loss to myself and, I'm sure most Outpatients if it all came to an end.
I am indebted to all the Moderators who work so hard to keep this forum running. I hope, like all before me that runcible reconsiders and returns. Thank you Spiritualized forum.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by olan » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:56 pm

TheWarmth wrote:I think if we all make an effort, we can revive the forum. I'm willing to do what I can, even if that simply means being more involved and posting more frequently. I hope Mark L. and others who might be thinking about leaving reconsider and decide to stay. I've been a member for something close to 15 years and I have no intention of going away.
I was surprised to see that I'm on here for 11 years and probably lurked for three years before that. Over that time the forum has gone through peaks and troughs of activity. My guess is that as soon as Jason & Co (or even Sonic :shock:) actually announce some dates and news of the release of the new LP the traffic will pick up markedly. The forum meet ups for Spiritualized gigs and the likes of the Heads or various festivals really kick things along. Other than sorting out funding the server I'm voting for not pushing the boat out too much yet. It is a bit feckin' quiet though.... :wink:

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by flokie » Wed Mar 22, 2017 9:19 pm

I agree with a lot that's already been said here. I had no idea what happened thru PMs and all that, and sad to see people being driven away, and certainly hope some - inc Runcible! re-consider.
As for the funding for running this board - surely some crowdfunding/paypal appeal could be set up? I'd happily chip in and I'm sure many would.

I'm only a recent member compared to many of you, and I've actually only been back a few months after a break - not caused by anything on the forum may I add! But I've always found it a great place to find out and discuss music and talk other stuff too. Social media just isn't the same as message boards.
I'm also going to put an effort to try and post more often too. Don't let the very few ruin it for the many!

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by mc » Wed Mar 22, 2017 9:47 pm

Just to add my own loving tribute to this forum, and the respect I have for so many people who post here - I've not met anybody in person, but exchanged many kind messages/emails with forum members present and past. Regarding the banning in question, I trust the moderators and I feel they wouldn't've have made that decision lightly. Overall, the most important thing is the health of this great wee community, and it's up to the mods to ensure it stays as healthy as possible by whatever means they think necessary. Thank you to all the mods for the wonderful work you do behind the scenes - it's hugely appreciated here :D

Beyond that, I really hope Mark Runcible stays as moderator/member/whatever he feels comfy with, and that all those who've considered leaving stay as well. I had no idea he was shouldering the cost of the server fees, and like many folk have said already, I'll gladly chip in a regular subscription fee to keep the place going if that becomes required. I've been posting sporadically here for nigh-on 13 years, and on the old forum before that (God, how time flies!) and it'd be a huge loss if this place ever disappeared.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by spzretent » Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:14 pm

Mark Modlab paid for the server before Mark Runcible.
Before that is was Nightwash who's real name is Thorsten who does all the techy stuff. Without whom.....we would be screwed.
And now you know his name is Thorsten. :wink:
Prior to that I believe Sony paid for it and did for a good 5 years after Spiritualized left the label.
So a thanks goes out the their auditing department(or lack there of).
This board will continue on. Be it thru crowdfunding or another person picking up the slack. It is probably my turn if we go that route. I would be happy to oblige if it comes to that.
Like I said earlier, this board means way too much to way too many to just let it fizzle out.
That doesn't really mean more posts.
Historically, as Olan succinctly pointed out, this board kind of falls asleep between releases and tours. Maybe it is more pronounced now that we are currently in the longest drought with no new release. That means no shows, no merch, no artwork, no track listing to banter about.
Hopefully this all changes soon.
C'mon Jason!
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by johnnyboy » Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:13 am

The passion is strong here isn't it and I agree with all the posts above. I don't check in here all the time but when I do there's always something interesting to read, a new sound to investigate, a gig review that makes me want to go to even more gigs, a funny story and all that jazz, you get the gist. It's the one music forum I can rely on for great musical knowledge beyond the band the forum is based around. It's a cool place to be.

I really hope that Mark L hasn't packed his bags for good, that'd be a real shame and a sad situation for all. I've never met the guy but through here he contacted me about 5yrs ago when I was splitting from my wife and he sent me some amazing messages after sensing through my posts that something was up. I found it one of the most kindest acts I've come across in the internet world of band forums and the like. Seriously, it was so nice of him. Really long messages, encouraging me to go on, offering advise, making me laugh, sharing food recipes. Ever since then I've counted him as a friend, just one I've never met yet.

As for the banned man, if I'm honest I could never get through his posts so whenever I saw those bold lettered posts I just ignored them, too long winded for starters. I tend to ignore posts about politics in general as well.

Keep on keeping on.x

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Aquarian-Time » Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:58 am

Yeah, to be honest I don't mix politics and music, so never looked in on that thread, so I perhaps was a bit hasty and misguided in my initial reaction to his banning, I'm blaming a crappy morning at home and work :D
Anyhow, I think we have hit on some key points a) People are happy to contribute to keeping the forum going b) We all like it here.
Onwards and upwards

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by clewsr » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:01 am

Touching story Johnnyboy, I hope things are more settled now. It is is easy to forget how much the mods do and have done - I had no idea for instance that people have been paying their own money to keep this place afloat. Some sort of crowd funding seems a sensible next move and might even help to increase the number of posts people make.

Like others I visit here and post much less regularly these days, time is swallowed up by work and kids, and then exhaustion. Perhaps I'll try and change that a bit.

I used to enjoy the politics posts as it is always interesting to hear opinions of people - whom I respect - on the topics of the day, but perhaps it is all too toxic these days. I often get quite a fright when reading below the line of even the Independent or Guardian. In the context of what is written (and not moderated) in newspaper comment forums I didn't find Semi's posts worthy of censure, but if it is driving other forum members away then perhaps it is time to forget the politics and focus on music. I trust the mods and if they really felt it was necessary to ban a member then so be it.

Simon Keeping - So those CD's were your idea? I recently dug out quite a few of them to listen to and it was great to hear again. Such a lot of musical knowledge that I have benefited from in this place. Lets keep it going.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by rameses » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:28 am

Just to add my thoughts, I don't come here as often as others or even as often as I used to, but when I do have time it's always time well spent.

I've met (both personally and virtually) some great people on here and will be happy to contribute what I can to keep the forum going. Like others I wasn't aware Mark was paying for this.
It's nice to be liked,
But it's better by far to get paid.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Aquarian-Time » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:28 am

I'm all for doing the cd compilation swap type thing if we can resurrect that idea

rameses
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by rameses » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:41 am

Aquarian-Time wrote:I'm all for doing the cd compilation swap type thing if we can resurrect that idea
I'd join in. :D I still listen to some of the CDs from the last one.
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clewsr
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by clewsr » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:45 am

Yes. I'd be up for more comps.

MODLAB
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by MODLAB » Thu Mar 23, 2017 12:07 pm

Me too. Slight problem as I do not own a cd player anymore.

:cry:

USB Stick?

M


Thinking about USB sticks. How about a Forum branded pill shaped USB stick? Not very expensive either. Just t thought.
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Design.

angelsighs
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by angelsighs » Thu Mar 23, 2017 1:22 pm

I must also admit ignorance to all the drama that was going on. although clamping down on free speech could be seen as a slippery slope, I trust the mods here to know what they are doing, and it's not a decision they would take lightly.

I can only concur with what others have said above. you only realise just how good this forum is when you visit others- and just see trolling, screeching arguments and in jokes.
I'd happily chip in a financial cost to keep this place running. I've met some great friends via this place and had some great times. not to mention, of course all the music recommendations. I could reel off a list of acts I first discovered on here.

and a compilation swap is a great idea and would be a good way to celebrate the forum!

rapideye
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by rapideye » Thu Mar 23, 2017 5:14 pm

This has all been a surprise. I had no knowledge of the banning etc until this appeared. I can't say that I am for the banning but from the reasoning that Spzretent has offered I can understand it. Everyone is allowed an opinion but that doesn't mean we have to have it forced on us. He was a difficult read though and his opinions and rants made no sense to me. At times he struck me as a plant of some sort but then I do like a conspiracy...

I've been coming to this board for about 15-16 years, I think, and although I'm not the most prolific poster, nor the most interesting either, I would be gutted if this place disappeared. This is my go-to place for music recommendations and you have all shaped the tastes I have today. I know none of you but yet I feel I know all of you. I've been to gigs before and have thought to myself just who is Runcible, BZA, Laz etc. I'm not really the sort to suggest meeting up but I think it would be good to do that sometime.

I would be more than happy to contribute to the funding of this site going forward. It makes sense that the cost is spread and that no one person bears the brunt of it. Why hasn't this been suggested before? I think that this may encourage each of us to feel ownership and a responsibility to the site. It surely has to continue though. The CDRs are a great idea - I've got some terrible selections to bore you with.

I hope that Runcible comes back. He always comes over really well and is a big part of this site's history. He also seemed to hate Man U and that, in my book, is a true measure of a man :wink:

ro
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by ro » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:05 pm

Some wonderful posts here.
Thanks to everyone who has put in their, time, talent, money, and love into this place.

I had some lovely exchanges last year with semi, as we are both enthusiastic fans of antiquities and oddities.
But I guess I understand why what's happened has happened. Some things you just don't do, sharing of private messages.

Excelsior...

edited several times due to changing mixed feelings about situation...
Last edited by ro on Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:41 pm, edited 3 times in total.

beaker73
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by beaker73 » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:33 pm

Haven't posted anything for quit some time, but have been lurking on a daily basis, mostly in the Music section. So I missed this whole thing, until yesterday when I decided to check some other topics. Anyway, like others before me, I just want to express my thanks to the mods and all the members for introducing me to all sorts of music and the fun conversations. This place is special to me and I'll do my bit to make it stay. Compilations? Financial contributions? Bring it on! Outpatients FTW!
cheers, Beaker
"I've been drinking all night long, but my hands are steady"

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Shinesalight » Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:54 pm

Man, I've been as "guilty" as anyone in not posting half as much as I used to. Along with the usual (day job, family and house improvements) I have the record label taking up more of my time these days but I still log in almost daily and have a quick scan and see whats happening. Like many, I pretty much skim-read the political threads (particularly Semi's meandering posts) so was pretty much unaware how bad things have got.

Like others have commented previously, it is a fine line between someone crossing the line and potential dictatorial censorship. Semi always seemed to me to be cut from a different cloth to most on here, he seemed to be from an older generation with a different life style and concerns (I quite liked the whole "romantic" image of a hunter/gatherer living out in the badlands) and I just thought, regardless if I disagreed with most of what he said, that it was quite good that we had someone who could speak out from a different perspective. I didn't have much private communication with him but, when I did, he was always very polite and was always very positive and supportive about the label I set up. Anyway, if he's really put people's nose out of joint, has had God knows how many yellow cards, what else could have been done.

With regards to the Mods, I never realised anyone on here was personally funding the site and for that alone I tip my hat off to you. To have to read and monitor some of the nonsense that gets spouted on here is a high enough price to pay without anyone having to be out of pocket. Like everyone else, I hope that Runcible has a change of heart (Spzretent you should show him this thread and let him the know what the majority of regular members think), I particularly liked his gig reviews and I am pretty sure it was his love of the Wooden Shjips which started off my exploration into modern "psych". The fact that he used to wind BZA up over Primal Scream was always a plus point in my book too :wink:

I'm going to echo the love for this forum too. I think I've been on here over 10 years now and can say it has been the best reference point for music recommendations that I have known. I have also met quite a few members and have become pretty good friends with several of them, meeting regularly for gigs. Without banging on about my record label too much, I don't think I would have even considered doing something like that if it wasn't for reading about so much good music on here. I hope this whole episode brings about a newly charged and motivated forum. I guess the lack of actual Spaceman activity hasn't helped matters but hopefully that will all change soon and I am certainly looking forward to hearing his collaboration with Follakzoid.

Lets see where we go from here :D
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mc
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by mc » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:24 pm

This thread just keeps revealing how lucky we all are here - I had even less of no idea that Mark Modlab and Thorsten Nightwash paid for the forum before Runcible, so many thanks and kudos to you both :)

I've been thinking about the whole issue of banning, free speech etc, and I keep coming back in my mind to Runcible's bar metaphor. To continue it further, this forum is my favourite internet "bar". The mods both run and own the bar, and everybody else is a customer. Every bar wants and needs its regulars to keep the place going, but what happens when the actions of a particular regular starts scaring off numerous customers both old and new? In a real bar, I think the barstaff/owners would have to bite the bullet and ban the offender, because irrespective of the rights and wrongs of said individual's behaviour, they're hurting trade and potentially putting the business in jeopardy. Having grown up in a small rural community, I know first-hand that this kind of thing happens in local pubs (or is left to fester to the detriment of trade and community happiness!), and I kinda feel like that analogy works here. I could be wrong though (and overly fixated on spiritous beverages ;) )

For me, this xkcd cartoon frames the free speech aspect of things better than I ever could, and although it specifically refers to US law, I think it applies well universally:

(I'm not calling any members past or present an 'asshole' via this cartoon, BTW, it's just an illustration...)

Image

Anyway, there's been so much activity on the forum these last 36 hours, and it's really heartening to see a crisis bringing a community together, rather than dividing it further :) For my part, I'll do my best to contribute more, and love the idea of sharing comps by any means.

I mentioned earlier that I've not met anyone on the forum in person, and that's entirely down to my own reticence; I'm usually a rather introverted type, and the thought of meeting "folk off the internet" has always been rather daunting, even when plans are actively made to meet before/at a gig I'm going to as well. It's probably time I should get over that hurdle, so if any of the board's Scottish contingent want to meet up next time the Spaceman comes to our fair country, I'm up for a pre-show beer or two :)

ro
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by ro » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:48 pm

Got my heart on my sleeve and it's messy ❤
Last edited by ro on Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Laz69
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Laz69 » Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:02 am

mc wrote:...so if any of the board's Scottish contingent want to meet up next time the Spaceman comes to our fair country, I'm up for a pre-show beer or two :)
You're on! I regularly head along to shows in Glasgow, so if we're heading the same way, we'll make a point of it. :D

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by toomilk » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:12 am

Without this forum, I would have never met (much to the chagrin of my lady friends) the wonderful James T, who I consider my closest friend! I've met countless others as well in so many countries.

I have so come across so many people, records, posters, comps, etc etc where the stories surrounding them all start with "This one person on the Spiritualized Forum..."

Another random note - who still has their official Outpatients tshirt? I met up with a friend a few months ago and his coworker was wearing THEE Outpatients "Highest Show on Earth" shirt. I immediately asked him what his username was, which definitely weirded him out. I explained the shirt to him, which he had gotten off eBay. Anyone gonna confess to this heinous crime?!?

a beautiful shonn
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by a beautiful shonn » Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:29 pm

welcome back from the dead I know :twisted:

man, you leave this place for 10 years and people start to get banned. well, it's about time!

i know it's been ages since i have posted, i do pop by every few months to make sure it's still here. it would be sad day if this site was to go the way of the dodo.

Runci, Spzretent, BZA, and all the other MODS, thanks for all the great work over the decades, i don't think i have ever properly thanked you lot.

So basically i came by to say...don't leave Runci.
Last edited by a beautiful shonn on Sun Mar 26, 2017 3:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

The Dr
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by The Dr » Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:38 pm

if this is about the Donald/Hillary thread- I found it tedious so I stopped reading it...I took the decision to stop reading it. I found that the arguments on it were- well, arguments, neither side willing to yield so why let it continue?

I met a forum member once who said that he quit the forum as he felt that the mods were allowing people to bully this person. whilst I cannot say if this is true or not the whole thing seems rather petty and comes down to personal responsibility. there are many other wonderful threads to read- why go somewhere that will make you unhappy?

there is no need to ban, there is no need to quit. I think people are just caught up in the moment and the emotion

if it is who I PM'd nightwash to ask if it is this user that is banned then I, for one, am personally sad for he helped me with some personal stuff through pms. I though that thread was pointless so I avoided it, but for it to cause mods to quit and people to be banned is just sad, very sad.

if ru doesn't want to be a mod and/or pay (as he has very kindly done) then you can have a donate button as other forums do, i'm sure people here will happily pay a little for it and he can use it as a common folk like the rest of us. why leave your happy place with your friends just because one person disagrees with you? it's life and if everyone agreed it would be boring

this whole situation seems absurd and can be easily rectified by each forum user making the decision not to read certain threads!
“You're not Dostoevsky,' said the citizeness

'Well, who knows, who knows,' he replied.

'Dostoevsky's dead,' said the citizeness, but somehow not very confidently.

'I protest!' Behemoth exclaimed hotly. 'Dostoevsky is immortal!”

mc
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by mc » Sat Mar 25, 2017 11:14 pm

Laz69 wrote:
mc wrote:...so if any of the board's Scottish contingent want to meet up next time the Spaceman comes to our fair country, I'm up for a pre-show beer or two :)
You're on! I regularly head along to shows in Glasgow, so if we're heading the same way, we'll make a point of it. :D
Sweet! Already looking forward to it :) Come on Spaceman, get the Barrowlands booked! (failing that, the ABC will do...)

heisenberg
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by heisenberg » Sun Mar 26, 2017 10:50 am

toomilk wrote:
Another random note - who still has their official Outpatients tshirt? I met up with a friend a few months ago and his coworker was wearing THEE Outpatients "Highest Show on Earth" shirt. I immediately asked him what his username was, which definitely weirded him out. I explained the shirt to him, which he had gotten off eBay. Anyone gonna confess to this heinous crime?!?
I still have mine. I'm kind of intrigued by this story. Maybe it was the banned user who put his on eBay ;p

runcible
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by runcible » Sun Mar 26, 2017 11:24 am

So...

Firstly the reaction to this situation was pretty surprising on my part. I didn't intend to create any personal sympathy or side-taking in all this. That said it's been touching to read a lot of the stuff written in this thread as well as quite a few emails and PMs on the subject.

Secondly without going over it all again I think the decision taken was the right one and I'll stick to that. The post by mc is one of the best I have read on this forum. The idea that free speech means valued people can leave if they wish in order to preserve the place of someone who caused said people to leave feels completely wrong so I don't agree with The Dr's post. Whether people are thick or thin-skinned doesn't matter. Personally I believed lines were crossed and action was taken after considerable discussion - and that discussion happened again and again over the years as we kept hearing about forumites abandoning the place. There is no doubt that others were hesitant to contribute at the same time.

Finally I think this situation has shaken the message board up in a positive way. There is some focus now whereas a few weeks ago I felt the place was heading into a darker area.

I paid for the place because I believed in it passionately and having read what's been written since I took a step back makes me believe it it once more. It was (the much missed) twentysixdollars who was first set as a moderator here about 18 (?) years ago, and he approached spzretent, myself and (the also much missed) stevie to be the original team. Personnel have changed a little since then, and the forum has gone through all sorts of stuff. Some of it has been hard work - the immediate post-hacking era almost caused everyone concerned to jump ship as it was a nightmare. Thankfully things changed dramatically because of Thorsten who is actually the most important figure in all this and who we all owe more thanks to than anyone could know.

So back to reality now. Some great threads have been started in my absence and I need to catch up. Also seeing Shonn's name pop up made me smile - welcome back!

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by spzretent » Sun Mar 26, 2017 2:53 pm

The moral of the story is words do matter. Positive or negative.
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ro
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by ro » Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:19 pm

runcible wrote:So...
welcome back to you, runcible, whenever you may possibly return.
and sincere thanks again to thorsten/nightwash and everyone manning the ship.

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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by spzretent » Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:45 am

Here is something I forgot to mention in my initial post in this thread.
When Sweet Heart Sweet Light was released there was an uproar on the mastering and especially the UK vinyl.
We got word to Jason's then manager and he rectified the situation with all those who purchased the UK white vinyl LP to get a replacement copy.
Now that is down to all you forum members and us moderators having a direct line to management. The record company absorbed the cost for that.
So kudos to you guys for bringing this to our attention.
Shit does get done around here.
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Detroit, Music, Sports and Other Stuff(including Spiritualized, Spacemen 3)

sm-iom
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by sm-iom » Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:45 pm

Hah! Pulled out that record yesterday to listen to, realised I had two copies, and then remembered the white vinyl issue - so, opted to listen to the black!

Stuart X.Hunter
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Re: Banning of a forumite

Post by Stuart X.Hunter » Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:25 am

...stops; glances left...raises eyebrows, sighs...
...return face, walks away...singing "I remember the time it all fell in line on the 3rd May"

B,
S
Aim to do at least two positive things each day

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